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‘Darth Xander’ files motion challenging Scientology’s anti-protesting injunction

Discussion in 'News and Current Events' started by CommunicatorIC, Sep 26, 2015.

  1. Tony Ortega: ‘Darth Xander’ files motion challenging Scientology’s anti-protesting injunction

    http://tonyortega.org/2015/09/26/da...ologys-anti-protesting-injunction/#more-25741

    * * * * * BEGIN EXCERPT * * * * *

    On Friday, Illinois attorney [REDACTED], better known by his nom de guerre “Darth Xander,” filed a motion with the Pinellas County Circuit Court in Florida asking to dissolve the permanent injunction that the Church of Scientology managed to get against the Lisa McPherson Trust back in 2001.

    [REDACTED] lives in Chicago, but he frequently travels to Clearwater, Florida to picket and videotape the key Scientology facilities of its “spiritual mecca,” and repeatedly he’s run into trouble because of the injunction, which was intended to regulate a completely different set of people from a very different time.

    “I’m tired of having to talk about the injunction with Clearwater police, and I figured it would save me a lot of time in the long run if I just asked a judge to dissolve it,” [REDACTED] tells us.

    * * * * * END EXCERPT * * * * *
    • Like Like x 12
  2. anon8109 Member

    Darth Xander doinitright.
    • Like Like x 6
  3. Darth Xander Member

    We'll see. Wish me luck.
    • Like Like x 20
  4. OTeleventy Member

    Goodest of luck, Darth. I think the odds are in your favor, but I hate the thought of all the pushback you are going to get from the clams. Be safe, as our friend Boris would say.
    • Like Like x 3
  5. Jeff Jacobsen Member

    I LOVE YOU DARTH XANDER!!!! and I have a copy of the permanent injunction if you need it.
    • Like Like x 6
  6. BigBeard Member

    Does all the video they've given the CPD showing $cilons getting 'up close and personal' with protesters, in spite of the injunction also requiring them to keep their distance, help any with this?

    BigBeard
    • Like Like x 5
  7. Darth Xander Member

    Yes, it will be a factor.
    • Like Like x 9
  8. BigBeard Member

    Good! I really hate the way they play the, "Rules apply to them, not to us.", game and keep getting away with it.

    BigBeard
    • Like Like x 8
  9. Random guy Member


    balls_of_steel.jpg
    • Like Like x 6
  10. I wish you luck, Darth.

    The scilons have abused the injunction at every turn, to intimidate and silence anyone who documents the obscenity of slavery and child-labour of the sea-orgers in Clearwater.The police have behaved like dim-witted stooges, unlawfully depriving you of a basic right to protest - based on a defunct LMT and an injunction that is way past its Use By date. If the police aren't able to guarantee that right, then it is up to the judge to do so.
    • Like Like x 3
  11. Random guy Member

    Say, doesn't the cult own the old LMT building in Clearwater? If the injunction stands, could Mark Bunker get them thrown out for trespassing?
    • Like Like x 3
  12. The Wrong Guy Member

    Our Pacific Northwest adventure begins this afternoon with a stop in Portland

    By Tony Ortega, The Underground Bunker, September 27, 2015

    Excerpt:

    ...we also wanted to follow up on yesterday’s story about the motion that Alex “Darth Xander” Hageli filed to challenge Scientology’s permanent injunction against the Lisa McPherson Trust, which was finalized in 2001.

    Alex shared with us a letter by Scientology attorney Wally Pope, who claimed that because Hageli was working “in concert with” one of the people named in the injunction (former LMT videographer Mark Bunker) then Hageli was also subject to its restrictions against protesting Scientology facilities in town.

    Hageli denies that he’s working with Bunker, and he said as much in his court motion, which asks for the injunction to be dissolved.

    Well, today, we want to show you a second letter Hageli received from Pope, who described what Scientology might do if Hageli dared to litigate against the injunction. Pope says Scientology would then ask for attorneys fees against Hageli in what sure sounds like a threat. Here, read it yourself:

    Continued here:
    http://tonyortega.org/2015/09/27/ou...egins-this-afternoon-with-a-stop-in-portland/
    • Like Like x 5
  13. BigBeard Member

    From the comments over on TonyO's regarding the new letter:

    BigBeard
    • Like Like x 2
  14. Malory Member

    So nobody's going to mention all this wouldn't be happening if Mark Bunker had just stayed away from Flag Down as requested?

    Maybe I've gotten it wrong and if so I'll be happy to hear the other side of the story and be corrected.
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Jeff Jacobsen Member

    If WBM's move to Clearwater is the catalyst that ends the injunction, I'll personally kiss his beard.
    • Like Like x 2
  16. BigBeard Member

    If F$O didn't constantly abuse the injunction against people who have no, or at best tangetal, contact with LMT members none of this would be happening. Shawn Lawnsdale being "served" for having lunch with Patricia Greenway. long before 'Flag Down', is a case in point.

    That's not the only such incident well before 'Flag Down' either. So while Mark being at 'Flag Down' may have stirred the pot, $cientology has been abusing the injunction very well without his presense as an excuse.

    BigBeard
    • Like Like x 8
  17. smh

    "Working in concert with" Bunker is exactly what he did. Xander planned and promoted a conference
    then allowed Bunker to not only attend, but to speak.

    To use a Scilon term Xander pulled this in. When he loses, the people who warned against allowing Bunker anywhere near Flag Down would be delighted if the kiss you planted was directly on their asses.
    smh
    This message by smh has been hidden due to negative ratings. (Show message)
    • Dislike Dislike x 10
  18. smh

    "Working in concert with" Bunker is exactly what he did. Xander planned and promoted a conference
    then allowed Bunker to not only attend, but to speak.

    To use a Scilon term Xander pulled this in. When he loses, the people who warned against allowing Bunker anywhere near Flag Down would be delighted if the kiss you planted was directly on their asses.

    Down vote away my pretties! The Bunker fanboys will be proven wrong. Bunker fucked up.
    Xander fucked up. I'll be sitting back waiting to say I told you so.
    smh
    This message by smh has been hidden due to negative ratings. (Show message)
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  19. smh

    Didn't Xander say it wouldn't affect his protesting? lol, looks like it did.
    smh
    This message by smh has been hidden due to negative ratings. (Show message)
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  20. smh


    "Working in concert with" Bunker is exactly what he did. Xander planned and promoted a conference
    then allowed Bunker to not only attend, but to speak.

    To use a Scilon term Xander pulled this in. When he loses, the people who warned against allowing Bunker anywhere near Flag Down would be delighted if the kiss you planted was directly on their asses.

    Down vote away my pretties! The Bunker fanboys will be proven wrong. Bunker fucked up.
    Xander fucked up. I'll be sitting back waiting to say I told you so.
    smh
    This message by smh has been hidden due to negative ratings. (Show message)
    • Dislike Dislike x 5
  21. incog712 Member

    "What I find interesting about Poop's letter is what's missing. Other than the incorrect statement regarding the permanence of a Permanent Injunction, he cites no case law to back up his assertions. The only cite is related to collecting attorny fees. You'd think if he really wanted Darth to be intimidated, he would have cited chapter and verse on why his case would be totally hopeless."

    Once more, scientology's ongoing abuse of the legal system has left their lawyers with nothing more to go on than veiled threats. Threats which bare no relevance to the actual issue at hand. Wally knows perfectly well that this injunction no longer serves any valid purpose but he has to baaaaaaawwww somehow, after all, as usual it's his only recourse.

    David Miscavige is going to be "very very angry". What is up with that boy? So reactive!

    Good luck Xander.
    • Like Like x 2
  22. Umm, do we really need to redact Xander’s real name ITT? It’s already in posts all over this site, on other anti-sci sites and on the net. Xander also is using it in the suit itself.

    So what's the point? We're supposed to be like scilons and pretend something easily obvious doesn't exist??
    Hombreay
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  23. smh

    "Working in concert with" Bunker is exactly what he did. Xander planned and promoted a conference
    then allowed Bunker to not only attend, but to speak.

    To use a Scilon term Xander pulled this in. When he loses, the people who warned against allowing Bunker anywhere near Flag Down would be delighted if the kiss you planted was directly on their asses.

    Down vote away my pretties! The Bunker fanboys will be proven wrong. Bunker fucked up.
    Xander fucked up. I'll be sitting back waiting to say I told you so.
    smh
    This message by smh has been hidden due to negative ratings. (Show message)
    • Dislike Dislike x 7
  24. Anon1942 Member

    smh your mom's calling little trolls who want to be big trolls have to have naps
    • Like Like x 4
  25. Darth Xander Member

    Now that I've called their bluff, can't wait to see what Scientology thinks they got to make their case.
    • Like Like x 8
  26. smh

    Back in the day the truth wouldn't have been called trolling. The truth is many on this forum
    warned that this exact situation would happen. That Bunker being welcomed with open arms
    by Pete and Xander was a mistake. Remember? Then there is that little point that people would
    be served with the injunction if they let Bunker attend? Remember that? Xander said it wouldn't
    keep him from protesting and even did his little defiant dance at the Super Power building?
    Now he's claiming the injunction, right or wrong, is hindering his protests. Damn, if only
    people would have warned him first. Wait, they did.

    God I miss Herro. Herro would have given you all shit for doing the happy for this one. Xander
    was stupid. Now he's just being naive. The police told Bunker they didn't want to lose the injunction.
    At best the injunction stays as it, at worst they throw it out and create a new more restrictive one.

    You fucking idiots have completely lost any ability for critical thinking. Jump up and down now,
    but I feel a Graham Berry situation coming on.
    smh
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  27. Malory Member

    So Bunker's going to be the hero even though he caused the problems by refusing to stay away from something he was asked to stay away from and even though he's letting someone else take all the risks.

    I hope like hell Xander kicks Scifag butt with this one but I certainly wouldn't give Bunker any credit for it.
    • Like Like x 3
  28. Back in the day the truth wouldn't have been called trolling.
    Back in the day the truth wouldn't have been called trolling.
    Back in the day the truth wouldn't have been called trolling.
    Back in the day the truth wouldn't have been called trolling.

    Yes.
    This is true.
    wayway
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  29. wayway
    This message by wayway has been hidden due to negative ratings. (Show message)
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  30. ^^^ This.

    In actuality, Mark Bunker stands to gain as much as anyone because he could start protesting in CW again. But only after Xander spends all his own time and money proving he was not in concert with Bunker while Bunker spends no time or money except on popcorn.


    Well played, Wise Beard Man, well played.
  31. Darth Xander Member

    With any luck there will be an appeal in all of this. And I'll have my second published decision. Not bad for a part-time litigator.
    • Like Like x 7
  32. incog712 Member


    At no time since the LMT has been dissolved has scientology actually attempted to apply that injunction in court, namely because they know that it is not worth the price of the paper that it is printed on and taking it to court will only draw attention to that fact.

    Since they know better than to do anything more with it than carry it around to toss out anytime they like as some sort of grossly unconstitutional proxy C&D, until someone else challenges it, they'll only continue doing the same.

    The fact that Bunker hasn't done so himself... whatev's. In any case, it's really got nothing to do with this thread aside from presenting an opportunity to dredge up some tired old Flag down drama once again. meh.

    • Like Like x 4
  33. Darth Xander Member

    They tried and failed to get it extended to Lonsdale.Oddly, even though they had me served with a copy of the injunction and apparently firmly believe that it applies to me, they never got around to filing an affidavit of service on me with the court. That is a necessary step before seeking damages for violation of the injunction, the only true way of enforcing it. Now, I wonder why they have thus far failed to do that if they really believe it applies to me. I'm sure they just forgot or something.

    07/13/2006 AFFIDAVIT
    Comment: AFFIDAVIT OF SERVICE OF PERMANENT INJUNCTION SHAWN LONSDALE; VER: F; P
    • Like Like x 11
  34. I have to say I was really excited at the first news. Xander going up against the cult on the LMT Injunction – AWESOME!!

    But then I started thinking about this a lot more. I have been involved in two suits, once as a plaintiff and once as a defendant. IANAL, so forgive me if I’m technically wrong about anything. However, I at least have some personal experience to draw from along with the volumes of info available about how the cult legal machine works.

    IMHO, I think this whole thing has huge risks at great expense vs. very small return.

    The cult is going to protect the LMT Injunction like any dude would protect his balls. It's not just about Xander, it's about opening up all former LMT protestors and anyone else to come out and play if they lose. I think that means the cult is definitely going to use their scorched earth policy, which means they are going to make Xander spend as much of his money and time as they can.

    Since he’s out of state and doing this all by himself, he will need to personally pay for deposition costs, court reporter fees, etc. He also will need to pay for a lot more trips between Chicago and Clearwater than his regular 3-4 times a year.

    If he lived near CW or at least had hired attorneys, this case could take several years like with Mosey Rathbun, Luis Garcia, Laura Decresenzo, etc. Factor in any and all appeals that the cult would certainly exhaust that the aforementioned suits never even reached and we're talking many more years.

    If however, Xander tries to fit all legal actions into his regular trips, it seems like this thing could take forever to get to some conclusion. I don’t know how long extra, but maybe double or triple the time on other suits? So what would that be? 5 years? 7 years? More?

    Plus another important factor is that the Clearwater police already said they want the LMT injunction to stay in place. Tack on probably even more time and money due to any factors that might come up from that.

    In the best case scenario, Xander wins, the LMT Injunction is dissolved and guys like him, Bunker, amaX, Tory, Jesse, etc., can protest anywhere in CW again. It could also rejuvenate protests in CW. But that would be after years of time and a lot of personal money. Also, none of the LMT guys are spring chickens right now in 2015, let alone how old they’d be once the case was over.

    In a middle-case scenario, let’s say Xander doesn’t get the entire injunction dissolved but gets a ruling that it doesn’t apply to him. Then he can protest where he wants in CW 3-4 times a year. Is that seriously worth all that time and money? Protesting in general against the cult has died to virtually nothing for a reason: it didn’t take them down. Yes, that includes going back to the actual LMT days in the late 1990s/early 2000s. And in the meantime, there’s ample evidence – even from Xander’s own vids – that they have grown in CW despite all the protesting that’s already occurred there.

    But in the worst case scenario what happens if Xander loses on his motions? The LMT injunction would now be fully enforced on him. It would be reinforced to be used on anyone else like him in the future. He spends many years of his life on this and a big chunk of his savings. He would additionally have to pay cult attorney fees which could easily be in the mid-five to low-six figures.

    Finally, no matter how this goes, I would think there would be a big emotional toll from such an undertaking. Just speaking for myself, I know how much I feel it sometimes from all the time I spend on Chanology on top of my own life, work and family. Needless to say the LMT injunction is a whole different league of activity that IMHO would be all-consuming and stressful.

    Before you start telling me that the bad side of things will never happen, remember Ken Dandar and the mess he's now in. Remember how fast Victoria Britton got shut down in the Kyle Brennan suit. If I'm not mistaken, Xander will be taking up his case in the same judicial jurisdiction as them. I could be wrong about that, but there is a similarity in that Xander's case has to do with Flag and will be heard in a Tampa Bay area court. Mr. Dandar and Ms. Britton have both had a lot to say about how fair things are in that area.

    With the magnitude of time and money involved in something like this, I wanted to put this all out there for discussion. I seriously hope there is some sunnier, legitimate scenario that is more likely to occur.
  35. Darth Xander Member

    Been watching things for a very long time. Thought of all of this and then some. I've made my move. We'll see what happens.
    • Like Like x 6
  36. Part-time litigator?!

    2nd published decision??!

    This is not puny Chicago Non-Ideal Org. This is billion-dollar a year economic impact Flag.

    I hope you're just joking (or not seeking out suicidal martyrdom). Because now I really am worried. :eek:
  37. Darth Xander Member

    I'm not. May Xenu have mercy on my soul.
    • Like Like x 3
  38. sallysock Member

    Good for you Xander. Please post if there are court costs that we can contribute to
    Just saying.
    • Like Like x 4

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