26 Page New Yorker article about Paul Haggis and scientology Possible FBI investigation

Discussion in 'Media' started by Anonymous, Nov 26, 2010.

  1. Miranda Member

    I think that fundamentalist rigidity will play a big role in the organization's demise. It seems all he's able to do is flatly deny anything negative, fling random counter-accusations and tell unconvincing lies on the belief that somewhere in the telling, they will become true.
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  2. Gary Moore Member

    LOLz! Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit! Enough Tommy - you had me at "apostate"!
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  3. exOT8Michael Member

    We had Baghdad Bob as the previous biggest fail spokeshole.
    Truthless Tommy might soon replace him as the biggest fail ever.
  4. Anonymous Member

    Suck it , Tommy.
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  5. AnonLover Member

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  6. It seems I had one medal incorrect. What was mistakenly labeled the Armed Forces Service Medal is in fact the Armed Forces Reserve Medal. Here's the updated image. Thanks go to Sponge for pointing out the mistake in this thread and BigBeard in another.

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  7. Anonymous Member

  8. Anonymous Member

    We must also remember that Marty's livelihood is linked to Hubbard's reputation, so he is suffering the same problems all spokespersons suffer when they have to defend organizations or persons of ill repute.
  9. exOT8Michael Member

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  10. Smurf Member

  11. ChrisO Member

    Nope, the Dutch medal claimed for Hubbard still doesn't exist. The forged notice of separation lists it as "Dtch. Vict. Med". The Bronze Cross is *not* the "Dutch Victory Medal" - no medal of that name exists. The closest thing to a "Dutch Victory Medal" is the Medal of Recognition 1940-1945 (see, which Hubbard never claimed to have been awarded. That medal was awarded for, essentially, still being alive and breathing at the end of the war. The Bronze Cross was awarded for quite different purposes - to quote Wikipedia, "Acts of courage and leadership in the face of the enemy." Note that unlike the 1940-45 medal it's not awarded on a pro-forma basis; it has to be awarded to specific named individuals by royal decree. It's the third highest Dutch military honour, equivalent in precedence to the US Distinguished Service Medal. Needless to say the Dutch have no record of it being awarded to Hubbard.

    I did mention the French one; it's one of the medals that Hubbard claimed in Flag Operations Liaison Memo of May 28, 1974 (see the list of medals at the top of The extended discussion of medals below relates only to what is listed in the forged notice of separation. I'm not sure why Hubbard claimed a French medal, but I have a vague memory that he claimed at one time to have fought alongside the Free French (God knows where).

    By the way, thanks to everyone who has been working out what the medals are. I'll update "Ron the War Hero" to reflect all of this new info.
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  12. AnonLover Member

  13. DeathHamster Member

    Maybe if he closes his eyes, and repeats "It's true for me, it's true for me..." while clicking his heels together three times?

    Hmm, that really needs a shoop, but it's Naruto night.
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  14. Zak McKracken Member

    repost, due to better quality pix
    + bump for valor


    which witch is which‽


  15. I'm gonna go with #1 being TRUE and HONEST and #2 is an imposter
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  16. Miranda Member

    Just thinking of Tommy D. in Dorothy's dress and shoes pleases me.
  17. DeathHamster Member

    Thank you! BTW, where is the live version of Ron the War Hero located? There are so many mirrors of it, and I was wondering if you'd been updating it.
  18. ChrisO Member

    I always thought it was ironic that the shittiest-looking document is the authentic one. :) You can tell it's been written on cheap, flimsy wartime paper.

    I guess the obvious question is who forged the latter document and when? The signatures both look authentic, but look closely at the second one - the leftmost part of the "L" is more elaborate, the R is taller and thinner and the "o" has shrunk to just an up and down stroke rather than a loop. If it was signed by Hubbard, which I think is more than likely, it was clearly well after the war - his signature has changed significantly but subtly. I would bet that if you gathered examples of Hubbard's handwriting from the post-war period and compared them, you would be able to work out when the document was forged.
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  19. RightOn Member

    Hey Miranda! lol!
    yes a shoop of this would be quite lovely

    And what WONDERFUL news to come home to! A shout out to Lawrence Wright and to the New Yorker.
    Got my copy :)
  20. ChrisO Member

    To be honest, I've not updated it since 2000 (bad form, I know). The "master copy", if you want to call it that, is the one at .
  21. Does anyone else feel like the 5th Harry Potter book, where the stories are finally getting out, and people are starting to figure out that WWP has been telling the truth the whole time?

    /nerd speculation
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  22. Miranda Member

    Hey :) yes it's a great article. He's painstakingly and ruthlessly thorough, and he doesn't overstate his case.
  23. DeathHamster Member

    Well, he claimed he was in the Battle of the Atlantic, so maybe he ducked over to Africa to help them out?
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  24. Miranda Member

    Of course it could have been in another life. Has this occurred to anyone?
  25. Anonymous Member

    In a previous live he was Winston Churchill. (The fact that Winnie had the bad grace to still be alive at the time is a mere detail.) A successful loose-cannon during the second Boer War, reporter, writer, politician, Sea Lord in WWI (Gallipoli, who's that?), rose to power during a crisis during WWII, favored odd-ball inventors... I'm sure that Cecil Rhodes was Hubbard's 2nd choice (until he heard the rumours about Rhodes) for Stolen Credit.
  26. Ahh don't worry about that... apparently you can live to lives in the same present time on account of your being in different MEST bodies or some shit like that. In any case, Scilon belief could dictate he was Winston Churchill, George Patton, and Adolf Hitler as well.
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  27. Anonymous Member

  28. Anonymous Member

    There must be an original knocking about somewhere as that's definitely a carbon copy!
  29. Miranda Member

    Well--that explains everything then. Both letters are factual; there were two L. Ron Hubbards who existed simultaneously. One was a war hero and the other, his evil twin, sadly got a lot more publicity.
  30. DeathHamster Member

    And then the CIA, Interpol, SMERSH and the Marcabian Psychs replaced the real Hubbard with the evil twin at various times after 1970.
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  31. adhocrat Member

  32. ChrisO Member

    It couldn't have been in another life - WW2 was in his own lifetime after all. :)

    One of the things I find interesting about Hubbard is that even when he's blatantly lying there's often a nugget of truth involved. He gave one of his most detailed accounts of his war service in what is now a very obscure early lecture, "Welcome Address", of 7 November 1959. (I didn't have this one when I wrote "Ron the War Hero" - it's among the new material that I intend to add.) Here's part of what he said:

    Now, here's the reality of what happened - it was a complete fuckup by Hubbard. He did go to Australia in 1942. When he got there he "assumed unauthorized authority" and then attempted "to perform duties for which he has no qualifications", in the words of the US Naval Attaché to Australia. This clearly refers to what Hubbard talks about in giving sailing orders and claiming to be the "Senior Officer Present in Northern Australia". There's a contemporary report by Hubbard, which you can see at , in which he admits sending a ship, the "Don Isidro", three thousand miles out of her way around the south of Australia. He very likely gave orders to multiple ships without authority to do so.

    His actions caused problems with his superiors. Hubbard had a meeting on February 2, 1942, with the US Naval Attaché and Military Attaché to Australia - a USN Commander and a US Army colonel - but he was blatantly insubordinate and stormed out of the meeting. In his own words: "Without taking further leave or further addressing either officer, who were now standing in the hall, their conversation and comment overheard widely, this officer put on his cap and left headquarters."

    A few days later the US Naval Attaché to Australia, Commander L.D. Causey, ordered Hubbard back to the United States and wrote in a memo to the Commandant of the Twelfth Naval District in southern California:

    Needless to say, this aspect doesn't get mentioned by Hubbard in his 1959 lecture!

    One intriguing aspect - in his 1942 report (page 4) Hubbard mentions a "Commander Thompson of the local Naval Control Service". I wonder if this could be the basis of the fictional Lt Cdr "Howard D. Thompson" on the forged notice of separation?
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  33. Anonymous Member

    Eh! You've lost me now!
  34. Miranda Member

    To quote DarkSpecterAnon:

    So, this whole thing turns into a mobius strip as LRH2 is the carbon copy of LRH1. Okay, I'll go play now and let the grown-ups talk.
  35. eddieVroom Member

    They also needed to be thin so the typrewriter would carbon-copy somewhat cleanly through a dozen sheets. This pre-dates the Xerox Machine. This type of paper was called "onion-skin".
  36. Don't you see? The War Hero had to be restrained so that the evil LRH could build his empire and clear the planet. This LRH (We'll call him Sonic for Hero, the othe Shadow for evil) was confined by the Marcabian Intelligence, to prevent him from trying to stop Shadow. Unfortunately, Shadow got into legal trouble and had to flee. Then, as it turns out, Shadow went on to write Battlefield Earth, (which is why it doesn't contain sexual fantasies like Mission Earth). Later this Shadow clone did not have proper life longevity and had to be put down, so Marcab had to use the Sonic version. They kept him roaming around in his Motor Home, so his screams couldn't be heard. Thus it's all okay. Sonic the Hero was the one they found with Vistarcil (sp?) in his system... so he wasn't the Shadow that wrote all the Scientology stuff.

    Sonic is a war hero
    Shadow is not, but he wrote Dianetics, and rode the coat tails of Sonic Fame
    Shadow started the Scilon Empire
    Shadow prooved to be defective, and had to be removed
    Due to psychosis... Sonic had to provide a credible death for LRH.
    Sonic was emacieated from his confinements, thus the reason that the tech didn't work to save Sonic's life.
    Sonic has never used Scilon Tech.

    Everyone on the same pagE?
    no? What don't you get?


    /Scilon Explanation
  37. Anonymous Member

    Barbara Schwartz v 2.0...
  38. tikk Member

    I knew this New Yorker story would conjure you from your hiding place Chris. I revisited the section of RTWH which discusses Prouty and the Notice of Separation and was struck how dead on you were. I suppose it'll be nice to update that as well.
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  39. OTXXX Member

    Anyone else wondering whatever happened to Shelly Miscaviage? I wonder if Gawker will follow up on that.
  40. DeathHamster Member

    I think Hubbard was FoS on that one. Senior Officer Present was intended that he could boss around any navy/marines present, of which there were apparently none, not that he could commandeer any ships that happened to be passing. He certainly wasn't in charge of any kind of land command. Navy Regulations/Chapter 9 - The Senior Officer Present.pdf
    I'd love to know what Hubbard was doing all by himself without adult supervision. I'll bet that he certainly wasn't where he was supposed to be.

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