Chick Corea and Scientology

Discussion in 'News and Current Events' started by username, Mar 14, 2008.

  1. username Member

    Chick Corea and Scientology

    Sorry to be asking for references again, but I never think to bookmark anything. Basically, I read something not long ago that went into detail about Chick Corea and his reunion with jazz fusion band Return To Forever, and how it was both directly and indirectly controlled by Scientology through some LA studio or something. If anyone knows what I'm talking about and can point me in the right direction it would be much appreciated. Thankyou.
  2. exOT8Michael Member

    Re: Chick Corea and Scientology

    Yes, I know some things about this.
    I was friends with Chick and with Stanley Clarke of Return to Forever.
    PM me and we can discuss it.
  3. Re: Chick Corea and Scientology

    He is rejoining with old band.. The name of the studio is called Mad Hatter.
  4. username Member

    Re: Chick Corea and Scientology

    Mad Hatter! That was it! Thanks Anonymouschick2!

    exOT8Michael, Check your PM's :)
  5. RightOn Member

    FRIED Chick- en
    • Like Like x 1
  6. The Wrong Guy Member

    An Interview With Guitar Legend Al Di Meola - Part 1 | Ultimate-Guitar.Com

    Here's the part of the interview that's relevant here. Quote:

    In 1976, Return to Forever recorded the third and last album: "Romantic Warrior." Could the band have gone on longer?

    Oh, god. Yes. C'mon, this band should have never, ever broken up. It was the biggest mistake Chick ever made.

    Why did the band break up?

    I blame a lot of it on Scientology. It's a really fucked up religion and the poor guy got caught up in it. It's a shame because here's a band that should have had a minimum of 10 more records further developed after "Romantic Warrior" without a problem then 40 years went by. We could have had at least 10 more landmark records.

    That really is tragic.

    But we were dealing with Scientology and the heavily religious ideology that Chick was obsessed with much to his detriment and the fans too. His ego was out of control and it's just a shame. I give credit where credit's due.

    You've given a lot of credit and respect to Chick Corea as a musician in this interview.

    I compartmentalize Chick the musician and the guy that gave me the break. There's no doubt about it how great that was and I'm very grateful. But the same it was he made very, very bad decisions. Extremely bad decisions. That was a supergroup whether he liked to hear that or not. He probably doesn't like to hear that but it was a supergroup.

    Without a doubt.

    It was the Beatles of fusion music and you've got to be smart. This is the music business and it's brutal, OK? So smart bands that maybe have not gotten along and even pretty famously not gotten along over the years like the Eagles, the Rolling Stones or the Beatles and even the Allman Brothers, get over it. Get over it. And they do and the vast majority of them went back out on the road.

    You think of the Eagles' "Hell Freezes Over Tour" and that's exactly what happened.

    Because it was more important that you play the music and make the fans happy and at the same time get very rich.

    Return to Forever really were poised to become the sort of American version of Yes and Genesis.

    We were ready for it to cross over into playing arenas across the United States. That was the next step though Chick in his insanities - and he had a lot of insanities - would wake up one day and go, "I want to have everybody vote for Gayle Moran, my girlfriend, [and eventually becoming his wife] to join the band as a singer. I want everybody to vote." This is when "Romantic Warrior" was out there and we had just signed a multi-million dollar contract with Columbia and we're all looking at one another going, "What? No way."

    That must have been heartbreaking.

    Nothing against Gayle who was a nice girl but it doesn't sit at all. So I voted no; Stanley [Clarke, bassist] voted no; and Lenny [White, drums] voted no. The managers who were Scientologists even voted no.

    What happened?

    What does he do? He fires us all. No, he didn't fire us all 'cause he couldn't fire us 'cause we were all on the contract. Everybody was an equal partner on the contract so he couldn't fire us. So what he did was he said, "I'm breaking the band up. I'm dissolving the band and I'm handing the contract back."

    You're talking about the record deal?

    Columbia went berserk. The president of Columbia just went absolutely berserk. He said, "Man, is there something mentally wrong with Chick?" I said, "I don't know, man. We're all very upset." He was like, "Oh, my god. This is a disaster." They were putting a ton of money in the band.

    What were the plans?

    Our next record was a $700,000 budget. You don't get this kind of money anymore. You don't get $7,000 to make a record anymore. It's over. The recording business is done. Then he gets either talked into or revamps his idea using our contract. By putting together a big band with Gayle Moran singing lead vocals and calling it Return to Forever [this lineup appeared on the subsequent "Musicmagic" album].

    Chick even called it Return to Forever?

    They go out on the road and you have three-quarters audience either booing or yelling out, "Where's Al? Where's Lenny?" It didn't sell any records and caused a big problem and then he broke it up for good. You fast forward 20 or 30 years and we do a one-month reunion tour, which was highly successful. Then he finds a problem again and it's done again.

    Is that what happened when the band had that reunion in 2009?

    He had to be in control of everything and he had to get paid the most, which is ridiculous. We're coming back as the Beatles. I happen to have 30 solo albums and I sold way more records than he sold but we let him have his way because it was Chick. We let him have his way.

    Why didn't the band stay together longer than a month?

    What happened was he kept all of the merchandising money and he applied all the money to things that were his. We made a triple DVD and a double live CD and the advance on that was a staggering amount of money and he kept it all.

    Chick didn't give you your portion of the money?

    My lawyer who put it together said, "Well, it belongs to Chick." I said, "You've got to be out of your mind. What do you mean it belongs to Chick? There are three other guys that happen to be very well-known." So I wound up suing the lawyer, Chick, the record company, the DVD company and the booking agent.

    Did you win?

    I won an astronomical amount of money out of court.

    Here's the interview:

    Return To Forever - Romantic Warrior

    • Like Like x 6
  7. RightOn Member

    wow I had no idea
    Like I said, head full of mush
    Thanks Scientology!
    • Like Like x 3
  8. I never paid atention tho this "Chick"

    It seems he is good at playing a Piano
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Quentinanon Member

    Thanks for the post. I remember those days well. I will fill in some of the blanks:
    Gayle Moran has just left a band called The Mahavishnu Orchestra whose leader, John McLaughlin, had a quasi-hindu guru by the name of Sri Chinmoy.
    So, Gayle gets recruited into scientology and meets Chick Corea, who becomes her boyfriend. Then, he mixes business plans with personal interests and farts out a "bright idea" that he can add vocals to Return to Forever, which was an instrumental group, with his new girlfriend, Gayle Moran.
    Chick had recruited the other band members, Lenny White, Al Dimeola, and Stanley Clarke into scientology, so he thought that they would just go along with his "theta" idea about inserting Moran into the band. When they did not, he went ballistic and gutted the band.
    In 1976, Return to Forever had become the most influential and popular jazz-fusion band in existence. After his tirade, the only band member who would work with Corea was Stanley Clarke, but that was short-lived when he saw the poor record sales and hostile crowds who hated Moran's voice and the new "Muzak" style Corea put into his work.
    Both White and Dimeola left scientology as well after that. Clarke left the "church" after the MusicMagic tour flopped in 1978. I heard that in the early 1980's, Clarke continued with Freezone scientology in David Mayo's group for a while.
    I had met Corea at Flag in the late 1970's and he came across as a toxic narcissist. Arrogant, grandiose, "it's all about me". And to this day he remains a KoolAid drinking Ronbot.
    • Like Like x 6
  10. The Wrong Guy Member

    If you were a musician, this was such an incredible time for music. Whether you played jazz or rock, the early days of jazz rock fusion delivered a major turning point that changed countless people's lives, including mine.

    It began in 1971, when the Mahavishnu Orchestra, led by guitarist John McLaughlin, recorded an album titled The Inner Mounting Flame.

    As an example, here's one of the songs from the album:

    Mahavishnu Orchestra - Vital Transformation

    Here's a review of this tune, written by Walter Kolosky on

    Musicians: John McLaughlin (guitar), Jan Hammer (keyboards), Jerry Goodman (violin), Rick Laird (bass guitar), Billy Cobham (drums)

    Composed by John McLaughlin

    Recorded: New York, August 1971

    Rating: 99/100

    Cobham's drum shuffle begins "Vital Transformation." McLaughlin introduces a dastardly multi-note pattern, which is most likely a compound 9/8 meter. Goodman quickly enters, playing in quick time, doubling on the initial pentatonic minor, first high on the neck and then sliding down it. The repetition builds tension. En masse, the band breaks away from the tune's restless anxiety with a resolving section dominated by Goodman and McLaughlin's soaring lines. John launches into a cutting guitar solo that becomes airborne, flying over an active polyrhythmic accompaniment. The piece resolves again, only to be diverted by the reappearance of Cobham's muscular shuffle. A group fadeout, accented by Hammer's ring-modulated electric piano, completes the transformation.


    Changing key, the Di Meola interview quoted earlier today mentions Gayle Moran. She's still married to Chick.

    Mahavishnu Orchestra - Smile of the Beyond

    Here's a sample of her singing with the Mahavishnu Orchestra and the London Symphony Orchestra, from the 1974 album Apocalypse.

    Not long after this album was released, I saw them in concert. When the lights dimmed and the curtains opened, the entire band, which included members of the Buffalo Symphony Orchestra, was dressed entirely in pure white. John walked out with his double-neck Alembic guitar, bowed to the silent, already-amazed audience, and whispered, "Good evening, brothers and sisters."


    And then the music began, and we were just lifted up and carried somewhere else. Somewhere we'd never been, although for some of us it felt vaguely, distantly familiar. Within a few minutes, between the music that was obviously not of this earth and the energy that filled the concert hall, it kinda felt like the whole stage was going to levitate.

    This was one of those rare concerts where after every song, you were so blown away you just wanted to just lay there in the afterglow, but a sense of obligation snapped you back and you clapped. After the concert, pretty much anything you'd have to say would be redundant because you had been taken to a place that transcended words.

    TL/DR: It was so rad.

    Mahavishnu Orchestra - Hymn to Him

    Here's one more track from that album, an instrumental.

    John McLaughlin is still playing, and playing very well. He remains as pure a musician as there ever was.

    John McLaughlin - Being You Being Me

    "Being you being me comes out of an experience of seeing the One in the many. I am personally convinced that the only real evolution in humanity will be when we all see the divine in each other, and so accord the respect that every individual merits."
    • Like Like x 2
  11. Those were the days right enough, I remembered he and Carlos Santana had a musical relationship for a while and my god I'm delighted it didn't last.
    Had Carlos Santana been indoctrinated into the way of Hubbardy his musical genius would surely have been interrupted by the influence of da do Ron Ron.
  12. White Tara Global Moderator

    mhmm, Saw Santana interviewed last year, fabulous man, glad he dodged that bullet
  13. Guitar Legend Al Di Meola blames Scientology for breaking up the band Return to Forever.

    "Chick" refers to Chick Corea.

    Ultimate Guitar: An Interview With Guitar Legend Al Di Meola - Part 1

    * * * * * BEGIN EXCERPT * * * * *

    In 1976, Return to Forever recorded the third and last album: "Romantic Warrior." Could the band have gone on longer?

    Oh, god. Yes. C'mon, this band should have never, ever broken up. It was the biggest mistake Chick ever made.

    Why did the band break up?

    I blame a lot of it on Scientology. It's a really fucked up religion and the poor guy got caught up in it. It's a shame because here's a band that should have had a minimum of 10 more records further developed after "Romantic Warrior" without a problem then 40 years went by. We could have had at least 10 more landmark records.

    That really is tragic.

    But we were dealing with Scientology and the heavily religious ideology that Chick was obsessed with much to his detriment and the fans too. His ego was out of control and it's just a shame. I give credit where credit's due.

    * * * * * END EXCERPT * * * * *

    * * * * * BEGIN EXCERPT * * * * *

    Chick, Stanley and Lenny all play on your first "Land of the Midnight Sun" album. You still had a relationship with them at that point?

    Those were very friendly times still. The first couple of years were very friendly and I was still the kid and still so happy to be there. I was - let's say in Scientology terms - controllable. But as I gained a little bit more notoriety and my records started to outsell their records by times 10, I had a little bit more of a voice. That's why "Romantic Warrior" is 100 percent a better record by far than the other two records soundwise.

    Is that because you were getting more of a voice in the band?

    * * * * * END EXCERPT * * * * *

    HT - chukicita on Tony Ortega's blog:

  14. White Tara Global Moderator

    Threads merged.
  15. The Wrong Guy Member

    The second part of the interview is online, and while there are no mentions of the cult, those who love the music may want to read it.

    An Interview With Guitar Legend Al Di Meola - Part 2 | Ultimate-Guitar.Com

    Here's part of the interview:

    Les Paul plays on "Spanish Eyes." How did you come to work with him?

    In 1977, I was on tour and he came to a show in New York City. I remember he walked backstage and I was like, "Oh, my god." I just dropped my guitar and stood up and said, "I don't believe it." He walks over because Les was like a real regular guy like one of the guys. He says, "Hey, what are you doing? What kind of guitar are you playing?" I go, "I'm playing a Les Paul." He goes, "Oh, you're playing me." I said, "Yeah, Les Paul."

    That's cool.

    So he gave me his phone number and address and said, "Please give me a call." I lived right near him in Mahwah, New Jersey. Two or three years later, I gave him a call. I was afraid to call him but I called him and he goes, "Al, how the hell are ya? What are ya doin'?" I said, "I'm doing a record, man. I'd like to have you play on it." He said, "Sure. What are you doing tonight? I'll come over and we'll get a couple of beers."

    Les was one of the most unassuming people who ever lived.

    He wanted to come over to my house but I wanted to go over to his house. I said, "No, I heard a lot about your place. I wanna come over there." He said, "Alright. Come on over."

    You went to Les Paul's house?

    I went over there about nine o'clock at night and stayed until six-thirty in the morning. He got me talking about everything. I'll never forget - Les Paul put a guitar in my hands when we were in his own studio and it was the first Les Paul ever made.

    That's crazy.

    He put it in my hands and I'm playing it and he says, "Play something for me. I want to record some of what you're doing. Just play it." He was running around like a wildman. He put the two-track on and then he kneeled down in front of me and his head was about that far away from my right hand [Di Meola puts his two hands about six inches apart].

    What was he doing?

    He was studying my right hand. I was looking down and I was with my girlfriend at the time and I'm looking at her and I'm going, "I don't believe this." He stayed down there for about an hour. For an hour, he didn't take his eyes off my right hand. He said, "How the hell are you doing that? How the hell are you picking like that? Nobody can pick like that." I'll never forget that.

    What a beautiful moment.

    Then he wanted to hear my records and I had some records with me.

    What did Les think when he heard your records?

    He was in complete awe. I said, "Yeah, I sure would like to get a hit record" and he's like, "Are you kidding me? This is where it's at. What you're doing is where it's at." It was nice to hear that.
    • Like Like x 1
  16. JohnnyRUClear Member

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  17. The Wrong Guy Member

    It’s Election Day, but screw that — Chick Corea is finally superhuman thanks to Scientology!

    By Tony Ortega, November 8, 2016


    ...we wanted to distract you from all of the political hair-pulling with something sent in by one of our great tipsters. It’s an article in the new Italian language edition of Freewinds magazine, and it features Chick Corea’s success story about OT 8.

    We mentioned previously that this is the second time Chick has achieved OT 8, which is expensive enough the first time around. Marc Headley has estimated that a Scientologist will spend, in course costs and other donations, between $500,000 to $2 million to reach OT 8, which is the top of Scientology’s Bridge to Total Freedom.

    By that point, you’re supposed to be an “Operating Thetan,” able to leave your physical body at will and affect matter simply with the power of your mind. Now, you might think that superpowers like that, and at those prices, would stick the first time! But for whatever reason, Chick went for a do-over.

    Now, there are jazz fans who will tell you that Chick Corea is already pretty superhuman, and we have no reason to doubt them. But it’s interesting to hear Chick give his own explanation for what he got out of this level, which on its own costs tens of thousands of dollars and can only be delivered aboard the Freewinds as it plies the Caribbean. Here’s what he said:

    This whole experience, from beginning to end, has been magical … full of wins, wins and more wins. As I advanced on my auditing, I found myself more and more certain that in reality I can actually accomplish things I had only dreamed of.

    In a recent graduation on the Freewinds I saw a video on an LRH quote regarding an independent attitude towards existence. I thought to myself: “This is my personal goal: to achieve an independent attitude in relation to existence and not be influenced by someone or something.”

    Well, now this has happened, big time. Many of the postulates and dreams that I had imagined and wanted to achieve had been quietly put aside. I found myself thinking: “Maybe someday…”

    I knew I was pulling back, but I did not know how to resolve it. This beautiful and simple level has helped resolve that consideration. I accomplished an independent attitude in relation to existence!

    I can be totally sure who I am and what I think, as I continue to play the games of life.

    In the middle of all the randomity that life can present, I now know that I can absolutely reach the goals and the dreams that I had put aside for a while. I can also reach all the new ones that I create.

    Another benefit of having completed New OT VIII is the factor that fun in my daily life has increased significantly. I like the physical universe a lot more. I’m more deeply interested in music … another big win. I would never have thought it could have happened, but it did.

    • Like Like x 1
  18. RightOn Member

    head of mush
    • Like Like x 1
  19. The Wrong Guy Member

    • Like Like x 1
  20. The Wrong Guy Member

  21. The Wrong Guy Member

    Chick Corea, Scientology celebrity

    By Tony Ortega, The Underground Bunker, September 15, 2018


    Current lifetime: Born June 12, 1941 in Boston

    Most famous for: Decades of great jazz

    Joined Scientology: In 1968, after reading books by L. Ron Hubbard

    Fun Scientology completion: OT 8 for the second time, 2016

    Chick shattering suppression: “I found L. Ron Hubbard’s books and lectures to be of great help to me in my effort to learn more about myself and how I could be more effective in helping my family and friends.”

    Chick has been a very dedicated Scientologist for a long, long time — perhaps the most dedicated celebrity Scientologist of all time, regardless of what David Miscavige says about Tom Cruise. It’s Chick who often supplies the entertainment at special Scientology events, and seems glad to do it.

    “He’s not leaving. He’s living in the past. He’s rehashing the past as an artist. He’s not progressing,” says our Celebrity Centre source. A Scientology publication in Italy, of all places, recently noted that Chick had completed OT 8, the highest level of advancement in Scientology. It turns out that it’s a redo — Chick also completed OT 8 a quarter century ago, in 1991. OT 8 is supposed to be the ultimate step to becoming an “operating thetan,” and having power over space and matter and the ability to leave your body at will. It’s also very expensive, in the tens of thousands of dollars just for that one level. So why need to do it twice?

    “I think they convinced him that they had changed it slightly and so he needed to do it over again. It’s so insane,” says our source. And as for being stuck in the past, which is saying something in an organization that puts a premium on being “PT” or “present time,” our source says it’s actually very common in Scientology. “The irony of it is that in any addictive situation, you’re stuck at the age when you first got in.”


    June 6, 2016: Chick Corea’s glib revelation to the New York Times about Scientology’s ‘Maiden Voyage’

    Nov 8, 2016: It’s Election Day, but screw that — Chick Corea is finally superhuman thanks to Scientology!

    Aug 4, 2012: Chick Corea, Heber Jentzsch, Ingo Swann, and Scientology’s 1977 OT Summit!

  22. A few posts up, there was a statement about clearing up the history of RTF and Gayle Moran, that has factual mistakes.
    1) Al DiMeola was NEVER a Scientologist. He listened patiently to Chick's recruitment attempts, but always said "no."
    2) Lenny White was NEVER a Scientologist. Pretty much the same reasons Al didn't dive into it.
    3) Gayle Moran played on two Mahavishnu records, "Apocalypse" 1974 and "Visions of the Emerald Beyond" 1975 before she quit, shortly after Jean Luc Ponty quit. Apparently the volume of the group began to get to her. She toured with MO during the period Ponty's replacement,, Steve Kindler - later in Jan Hammer's band, but that was the last stint. She was ALREADY Chick's girlfriend at the time he recorded the RTF album, "No Mystery" - which the inner liner has him holding her from behind around the waist in one photo. This was prior to her quitting the MO.
    4) The "Music Magic" album was a return to the acoustic version of RTF and was not bad at all - BUT - it should have been a side-project/solo album, and never put out under the heading of RTF. That album and the multi-record RTF Live in Concert did not sell anything like the electric band had - but as I said, they are both good records - even though the Scientology lyrics were very bad/crap. Concentrate on the instrumental parts!
  23. failboat Member

    Did he drop any good loot?
    • Like Like x 1
  24. candide2020 Member

  25. As reported by Nation of Islam Minister Tony Muhammad, one of Chick Corea's last collaborations was to play on a song in 2018 with NOI Minister Louis Farrakhan playing violin.


  26. candide2020 Member

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