Discussion in 'News and Current Events' started by scaryanonymous, Feb 21, 2008.

  1. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    That rabbit hole is deep, dark, and very very dirty.
  2. transientox Member


    I've found stronger evidence that Hilliard knew Mohammed Atta personally. ... 04x1433886
  3. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    It makes you want to take a shower.

    ANONYMOUS is operating on a VERY human level with care and concern towards the members of the CO$ and at the same time decrying the abuses of the corporation. This is successful, this is what PEOPLE respond to. It is what makes us LEGION.

    BUt to ingore the rabbit hole and the possible MOTIVES for resistance against us NOT ONLY by our own government but by other forces who also would disaprove of the SECRET RECORDS ever being opened is not wise.

    Our government is currently ACTIVELY resisting opening the secret contents of the IRS agreement with the CO$ that gives their church, and ONLY their church the ability to deduct religious education expenses. I do wonder how long that judge sitting on that case, will continue to demand that both the CO$ and the government pony up the secret agreement.

    Count down for the judge. He won't last long. At this very moment clams assigned to the case are looking into the darkest corners of his life. Soon he will get a copy of a dossier in the mail, false or true claims opened by the judge in the dark of night. Fair gamed by BOTH the gov, and the CO$ bedmates forever?
  4. deadacc19225 Member

  5. waianon Member


    This is all a little too deep for my taste. While there may be a connection, even if it's proved inconclusively I don't think it's something we could make the general public aware of concisely.
  6. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    If its true, then we must tell the masses about it. That's what I'd argue.
  7. anonymous3347 Member


    The following has nothing to do with the story at hand. It was a completely different situation, I want to make that clear.
    A long time ago, I brushed up against something like this. An old man at a nursing home was telling stories; at first I listened just to be polite, but then the stories started to get interesting. Think nerve agents/gas.
    So I decided to play Scooby Doo. There was no internet back then, even though it was aborning, but the old man was naming names and I was looking them up at the huge library, fiddling around with micro-fiche.
    I didn't get far, barely a toenail deep, but a couple of details seemed to be correct. When I went back to the nursing home, the old man was gone, and no one could or would tell me where he went. They didn't say he died, just transferred somewhere else, they didn't know.

    This is the first time I've even mentioned it, in over 20 years. The hairs on my arms are standing up and I feel a chill, even now. I found my own rabbit hole, but I lacked the combination of fearlessness and confidence to do more than peek at it. Rabbit holes are for the foolish and brave.

    Then again, I don't think any rabbit hole in history has ever been assaulted with lulz.
  8. xyzzy65535 Member


    Tell them what? That the flight school Mohammed Atta trained at was owned by a business partner of an arms dealer several of whose family members are or were Scientologists?
  9. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    There aren't all that many $ odd that^

    But just for comment's sake, if we change the sentence to read

    That the flight school Mohammed Atta trained at was owned by a business partner of an arms dealer several of whose family members are closely related to HIlary Clinton...

    Would that spark an investigation?
  10. xyzzy65535 Member


    They make recruiting targets out of the rich and famous and their families. Hence the Celebrity Center. It's not a cross-section of the public.

    Do you really think it would? Do you really think it ought to (whatever the name we change it to)? Why?

    See, even if we could strike out the words "a business partner of", it would only become an interesting fact to someone who thinks the flight school wasn't thoroughly investigated after the attacks for the least shred of evidence of connection to the crime. Anyone who remembers the mood this country was in at that time will have trouble even imagining that it wasn't. I am certain I am not alone in saying I find it ridiculous.
  11. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    For more rabbit hole digging take it here: - 9/11 Conspiracies - Really Above Top Secret - Research Forum Discussion (BEST BET) - General Conspiracy - Deconstructing Disinformation & Deflection - Conspiracies in Religions (Least Useful) - War On Terrorism (Really Useful) - Political Conspiracies

    Yeah the site has some oddballs... however there are a few good rabbit hole diggers and some prolly could make further connections with the information you have right now.
    What is a rabbit hole could just be a small part on a spider web.

    Then the information can be utilized in other areas.
  12. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    All I have to say to that as an oldguardintelweinie, is ...OK..."no matter what they tell you, no matter what they say, what you believe is true."

    And yes, if they make an issue out of someone reusing words you don't think they would have a field day linking Hillary Clinton to a flight school that was connected to 9/11, you bet it would and should cause an investigation?

    Hell round about now some person is taking a lie detector test to prove he's not lying about Obama, the blow job, and the coke. (not kidding, whether or not you hear more about it I suppose depends on whether he passas or fails.) GW told us who our next president will be. It has been decided.

    Three words is all I need to understand 9/11. MY PET GOAT.

    Understanding the way things work is the clue to taking them apart. Until the we understand all that the CO$ is, we will not be sucessful in flushing all the shit that is shit. If you are unwilling to accept AP news articles, and many other sources of documentation, nor to do research on the R1 visa and what it is in comparison to other visas, ect...then that's fine, but don't say there isn't any proof because there is. Few homeborn Americans truly understand how difficult it is to come to the U.S. legally. BTW I believe the Co$ is also going to be under the microscope on human trafficking (aka visa abuse). What they are doing is illegal.
  13. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    Commander I am an avid reader of all things up or down good or bad. I must look at everything from all sides, so I am familiar with those sites. I read a lot.

    Because I was watching TV that day, my brain knows what it saw, the signals relayed to the brain via the eyes, the brain calls up a memory and you are instantly able to say (for example) that's a car

    That day my brain knows what it has seen it before and thus had the memory stored. MANY MANY people also had the same experience I did, however they allowed themselve to be told they were wrong. That is the crucial point of winning anything, convince your opponent he or she is wrong. (see CO$ manual on this :mrgreen: )

    But aside from what we saw that day with our eyes, something odd was happening far far away in a land called florida. A timeline, and My Pet Goat.

    you want to know what really got me? Listening to the NORAD tapes of that day. I wept. It is one thing to wonder and play in the nevernever mental land of conspiracy, but it is quite another thing to hear with your own ears words you understand and KNOW. Literally, I wept.
  14. waianon Member


    I would argue that we should only try to push this information on people if we can do so in a simple, concise manner that doesn't overwhelm people with wheels within wheels or anything of that nature. In short, it has to sound believable at a glance. If you hand someone a leaflet packed with all the info we've seen in this thread so far they're going to look at it, think "What the heck is all this?" and probably toss it in the trash.

    If the connection proves to be substantial, put it up on the web, certainly. Maybe make Operation Clambake aware of it and see if the info can be added to that web site. But unless we can make the connection simple to understand, I don't think it's something we should be stressing heavily to the general public at the protests.
  15. qwerty Member


    Am I late for the partyvan?

    I have been lurking here for some time and now damn! You got me! I am with Scary. I have a penchant for the para-political and whilst examining C0S I found some deep dark holes indeed. When I find a hole what do is ask more questions and then try to find the answers.

    So here is one for you. A while ago I happened upon the Frank Kryder conspiracy. FK's fortune disappeared into the Carlye Group coffers- think Bush family/Saudi partnership- as painstakingly documented at Alex Constantine refers to the site in at least one of his investigations.

    What caught my eye is some kind of insurance thread connecting a "Kurt H. Weiland" to the insurance company that paid out to Silverstein- think WTC. It is baroque in the extreme and will take an MBA to decode or someone with more business smarts than me.

    There is a Kurt Weiland who is the External Affairs Director of OSA. It is unlikely that they are the same person, but I was unable to confirm one way or the other. But I took note of the related list of "Questionable Non-profits" which as we know are a CoS specialty. One of the NP's is for certifying the market value of human genetic material- I kid you not.

    So the question is: Is CoS connected to the WTC insurance scam and thus peripherally to Bush and the Saudis?
  16. qwerty Member


    And no, I don't believe that this information should be distributed willy nilly to the general public. What it requires is to be carefully documented and written up by an investigative journalist and/or published in Z Magazine.

    My 2c.
  17. Thetanonymous Member


    This is all well and good, and I'm sure we can get the conspiracy buffs going on this, but if we want to get real, hard news people or the general public involved in these kinds of investigations, we need something that can be NEATLY explained before eyes start to glaze over, and ideally summed up in a nice little idiot-proof soundbite.

    Things like "The so-called "church" of scientology gets tax breaks that your religion doesn't."
    Things like "The so-called "church" of scientology destroys families by their documented policy of disconnection"

    We have plenty of ammo to use against them. If we can turn up something through these investigations that's incontrovertible evidence that we can sum up without seeming like we're repeating "Back.......and to the left" for 40 minutes, then we have the nuclear option.

    Just remember that the vast majority of the world is completely happy to believe what is fed to them, and will regard anything even remotely :tinfoil:-ish with much suspicion, if not outright hostility :)
  18. waianon Member


    Exactly the points I was trying to make. Well said. :)
  19. transientox Member


    I don't know if a one-liner will do it... but I think the best angle of attack on this is that:

    * The CoS gives preferential treatment to the family of international arms dealer and drug trafficker Adnan Khashoggi, in the same way they give preferential treatment to Tom Cruise or John Travolta.

    Then have a concise summary on how Khashoggi is connected to the 9/11 terrorists.

    * Khashoggi's close business partner Wally Hilliard owned the flight school where the 9/11 hijackers trained.

    * Wally Hillard knew Mohammed Atta personally.

    Then talk about how the Church of Scientology has provided religious visas to known terrorists.

    For anyone looking at a glance, the implications are clear, that the CoS involves itself in corruption and even terrorism. They have no conscience.

    We'll just have to make sure we have more information prepared on Khashoggi, etc., for those who want to dig more (the conspiracy-interested types). Perhaps something to go on the website[/url:1hju71qq]?

    BTW, I would be very, VERY wary of any information that comes from Above Top Secret. They've been proven to be government moles. Sounds crazy already, I know, but this is what you run into when you start talking about 9/11.
  20. AnonKiwi Member


    Can we please keep the retarded 9/11 conspiracies clear of the real war and conspiracies of Scientology? Last thing we want is to muddy the issue with 9/11 retardation and all the stink that will stick to us if we go in that direction.
  21. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    As I have said before, above, we have the emotional impact of the easy to document and easy to diseminate information that IS WORKING. We do not need to tell average joe on the street about these other connections when we have so much other stuff that is quite frankly working.

    However I have NO problem with telling any reporter at a protest, to INVESTIGATE the CO$ ties to Adnan et al, and the issue of the R1 visa abuse.

    What people are not clealy understanding is that the FIRST issues will get the MAN ON THE STREET to pay attention. But it is the deeper, darker issues such as the R1 Visa problem ect. that will get the attention of politicians who would like nothing more than to deliver a blow of exposing illegality and impropriety of the "otherside" (you know pit dem against repub, they love this sort of stuff>) Thus any letter or conversation with a politician should absolutely mention these concerns. Mention the visas, the ties OF visa abuse to terror and the attempts of some organizations to look into the CO$ and human trafficking. Politicians love this, it gives them sound bites. Makes them look like they are rooting out corruption. And I hope all Americans understand that each and everyone of us has the right to demand a congressional investigation into a troubling issue. In short it's called a CON GRANT and this also works.
  22. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    And here is a PERFECT example of what I was talking about ... 681b9573b5

    The Feebs are not going to go about getting all warm and fuzzy about familial disconnection (as a group, personally they probably find if abhorent)..they like the juicy stuff like RICO, FRAUD, and Homeland Security/ICE will salivate and visa abuses.
  23. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    We should just send all this stuff to Alex Jones or that young guy that did the Loose change video. Let him dig down the rabbit hole. Maybe it will fill some of the 'holes" in his argument.
  24. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    Personally? I would avoid Alex Jones like the plague. I would feel out the loose change people, however they, like us, have their own mission and their "opponent" is far more formidable. They may say, nope too busy with this...but you never know.
  25. xyzzy65535 Member

  26. Thetanonymous Member


    Associating ourselves with the Loose Change people is tantamount to saying "Hi Guise! We really don't give a rat's ass about credibility or science! Have you seen my Crumple-Horned Snorkack lately?"

    Anyway - my feeling is that this is not a productive avenue to go down, so I'm done with this thread. If Woodward and Bernstein incarnate happen to be reading this thread and are capable of wrapping this up with a nice bow on it, by all means do so, but MY OPINION on this is that 99.9% of consipiracy theory stuff that is not on a giant screen portrayed by an actress with perky breasts makes the general public do whatever the IRL version of tl;dr is.
  27. musketeerwang Member


    Fuck Alex Jones and fuck Loose Change. That's exactly the kind of tin-foil-hattery we need to avoid like Hubbard himself were chasing us.
  28. transientox Member


    I'll give you a good reason to be very wary of Alex Jones.

    He broadcasts on Genesis Communications Network, which is connected to Khashoggi. Now, I can't demonstrate any solid connection, but when one knows the way these things work, Continuing Criminal Enterprises and such, it's easy to make the case that Khashoggi tries to avoid getting his hands dirty, and so has lackies do the dirty work of putting their names on these corporations. Ted Anderson is the guy you'll want to look at in reference to "owning" GCN.

    Saudi Genesis is a Continuing Criminal Enterprise of dummy corporations all with the word "Genesis" in their name.

    Remember what I wrote about Khashoggi being connected to the 9/11 Coverup Movement? Yes, even Alex Jones is connected to Khashoggi via GCN. Maybe you all didn't believe me when I wrote that there's a lot of disinfo on the internet about 9/11.


    And yeah, I wouldn't bring in any Loose Change folks either. Nothing against them, but we don't want Anonymous to be driven off message by a tarbaby of an issue like 9/11. If we want to make the case for a CoS connection to Khashoggi and terrorism, we have to do it ourselves, and we have to ensure it is brief, factual, and precise.

    Oh wait, Jason Bermas (Loose Change) broadcasts on GCN too.
  29. xyzzy65535 Member


    ^ You see? There's no end to it. Look, everything and everybody is "connected".
  30. AnonMomAnon Member


    i really wish that every younger anon made sure to read this thread.

    i would want them to remember what a clusterfuck this whole mess is:

    our government, arms' dealers, the Cult of $cieno's, shady business deals, 9-11, heroin smuggling, visa's for terrorists, cover-up's, the clinton's involvement, the bush's involvement, smuggling guns, wtf?

    my only hope for the future is that this younger generation seem to posess some things that are non-existant in the people who move and shake and run our world right now: good souls, good hearts, respect, dedication, and of course---lulz.

    once again, good luck to future anons in cleaning up the fucking mess we've left behind for you. i sincerely apologize that we couldn't clean our own mess up. i promise that i'll do all i can to help with whatever time i have left.
  31. Anonamour Member


    It is useful to study how disinformation is propagated and sold to the public as fact. CoS and it's allies utilize this tech. If you step back from the 9/11 multi-storied complex and read the workings of information control, you'll just become a more effective Anon. That simple.
  32. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    Exactly. I have had my suspicious of Alex Jones being akin to Hal Turner aka honey pot for dissent. He's just too far out there. Loose change youth, did good work on something they believed, I don't think that is any different than ANON doing good work on something THEY believe (CO$ is evil). Just because you think what they believed is nonsense does not eliminate the effectiveness of what they accomplished for what they believed. There are plenty who believe ANON is wrong for believing what they do, ANON has sources that say we're right, the loose change kids had sources that said they were right...wherein lies the truth? As always, likely somewhere in between.

    Again, I repeat it cannot hurt to mention certain buzz words to reporters, R1 visa abuse, human trafficking, ect.

    Things we don't put on signs...a reporter intrigued with this will find the information all on his own.
  33. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    My thought was just they could chase their tails, and if it comes up tin-foil, it's THEM and not us.
    If it does turn out to be something, then bonus!
  34. transientox Member


    Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way with these types.

    They may contribute some good information in the midst of mountains of disinformation, but it's hard to quote them or talk about them at all without being labeled a cook yourself.

    For my two cents, don't mention Alex Jones. Avoid Above Top Secret. Don't mention the Loose Changers.

    Stick to the facts, because we already have the facts we need to make our case.
  35. Re: CO$ and LINKS TO TERRORISM???

    ^ IMHO NEVER mention Alex Jones

    And you cannot mention Loose Change either, people recoil it's too much. This type of information is too brain exploding for most people. And most people cannot get beyond the initial thought, MY GOVERNMENT WOULDN'T...incoming information halts at that point. Same with the CO$ people being told of the crimes of the CO$. CLICK. ClAM.

    SInce objective is to reach people with information they can and will react to, it is counter productive to mention things that will make them go CLICK.
  36. Daywatch Member



    tailor your message to its intended audience
    for example
    when talking to local churches,religious friends, people who send their kids to private schools ect. mention "hey you know if you were a member of the Co$ you could deduct tuition or sunday school fees...that doesn't seem fair"
  37. transientox Member


    I found the full article about the Solomonyan case here: ... 22090.html

    BTW, there's a Digg story for this now. ... entologist

    Here's some more articles on Solomonyan from ARS: ... uggler.htm
  38. xyzzy65535 Member


    Couldn't you have copied the whole article? You left out the part about Khashoggi and Mohammad Atta and terrorism.

    ...What's that you say?
  39. transientox Member


    What's that I say? Did someone say troll? :roll:

    They're two separate stories. They might be connected if we could prove that Khashoggi was connected to this Russian mafia. (He's connected to practically everything else, Yakuza, Bilderbergs, former Nazis, so it wouldn't be too much of a stretch.) However, I wouldn't want to start looking for connections that aren't there. :wink:

    You fail at your understanding of this thread. Go back and read the first post[/url:17q8cv8t]. Otherwise, LURK MOAR.
  40. Samuel Hughes Member


    Okay ... I'm weighing in.

    We can find connections between anything and anything else, and maybe there's a real connection or not, but here's the point:


    The public has seen the articles and interviews proving CoS is a malicious cult. But they don't believe it because the truth WE KNOW reads like a sci-fi novel. Any accusations that can be easily dismissed or too hard to prove outright will be used against us.

    HOWEVER, keep researching and posting here, as if there is truth in the conspiracies, it will drive them mad knowing we are investigating THEM.

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