Dentists, Scientology and Me

username.unavailable · Mar 21, 2008

Dentists, Scientology and Me

First time poster, long time lurker here, looking forward to helping out where and when I can, but first I thought I should post up my account of my dentist attempting to recruit me into Scientology 7 years ago. Expect a long post ahead with the tl;dr summary at the end.

In the summer of 2001, I needed root canal treatment. I chose a particular dental practice for 2 reasons:

1) I was entitled to free treatment on the NHS and it was the only dental surgery in the city which accepted NHS patients.
If you live in the UK you'll know how rare this can be, becoming rarer still. To be eligible for NHS treatment you have to be either under 18, pregnant, have given birth in the past year, in receipt of a low income/unemployment benefits/a state pension, or ill enough to be exempt from charges - in other words, in a "vulnerable" situation.

2) I was extremely nervous of needles and they advertised "free relaxation classes" in the Yellow Pages.

Everything about my appointment was routine, even down to me jumping out of the door each time a needle came anywhere near my mouth. The dentist would've known that the damage to my back teeth was caused by depression, as I was told by a previous dentist (I'll spare you the gory details - Google or PM if you are that curious!) and so she would've also detected that weakness in me. Even by then, determined to persevere, I didn't ask about the free relaxation classes, but the dentist suggested "auditing" which they held every week at the surgery. I'd never heard of it before so I asked for more details and from her explanation I assumed it just another name for the relaxation classes.

None of the dental staff were at the class but it was held by a small group of people who came from Bournemouth/Poole, the neighbouring cities in which there is a mission. A couple in the group were wearing gold bracelets with unusual designs carved upon them, which I assumed were commitment bracelets. Not only did I later recognise the designs of as the Scientology "S" with the ARC triangles as the strange insignia on the couple's jewellery, I almost jumped the sofa myself when I saw them in "The Bridge". Before the class started, the women of the group were very sympathetic towards the females including myself, making small talk about my situation, easily coaxing family and financial circumstance information from them. They were wearing skirts which I considered very short, even at the time when I'd wear similar, and behaving far more flirtatiously or suggestively to the men than appropriate as I thought they should still have been considered as patients.

The talk was held before a backdrop display surrounded with books by L. Ron Hubbard. When I later saw how Tommy Davis was dressed in the Panorama documentary "Scientology and Me", I was reminded of exactly how the main, male speaker was dressed. I didn't understand what the talk was about at the time but it didn't have much to do with relaxation. It was about Dianetics and was presented, very persuasively, as the only way to resolve our fears, as if it was a foregone conclusion. In the middle of the "class", the speaker asked us to shut our eyes to visualise something but the following speech sounded more like science fiction than therapy.

I became aware that he was attempting to hypnotise us without warning and therefore without permission. Now, one of my college tutors was a qualified hypnotherapist and I'd attended one of his sessions 5 years previously with friends being the only one of us 5 unable to feel the effects. I peered between my eyelashes to look around at my fellow patients, thinking "surely no-one believes this BS?" but they all seemed to, so that thought was pushed to the back of my mind again.

Immediately afterwards, we were all asked whether we'd achieved our goals, whether we were happy with the session and whether we'd like to continue the course. I was admittedly curious but in the sense that I wanted to do my own research instead of having to make commit within their time scale. We were told that in order to carry on, they required £39 from each of us, for which we would receive 1 book. I then knew I definitely didn't want to continue the sessions yet inexplicably felt unable to say no, so I told them that I didn't have that kind of money as I was a young mother of a baby with a disabled partner to support at the time. I did have it, thankfully not on me at the time, but it was needed for food, bill and rent and losing it would've been a large dent in our very low income.

That should have meant the end of the story but despite this, they kept suggesting I could go to the nearby cash point to draw it out, use a chequebook or a credit/debit card: every payment method under the sun they could think of to persuade me to commit. All of the other patients were convinced enough to immediately begin paying so I <lied>promised to return with the money the next week</lied> so that I could make my excuses and leave as soon as I could. I was the only patient to leave without payment changing hands and although it's been suggested to me that the other people could have been Scientologist plants, I do remember one elderly gentleman paying without question and I've often wondered how much, or rather how little, of his retirement fund/pension is left now

Although quite disturbed by this in a way that I couldn't put my finger upon, I didn't make many connections about them, but after some research on the internet such as on the OCMB, I soon realised that one of the very dangers of Scientology is exactly that: without knowing about the preying on the vulnerable, the social engineering, the hypnotism and the post hypnotic suggestion, the story seems innocent enough to the layman.
When I spoke to my friends and family about this, some knew nothing of Scientology but were glad of the warning, some had similar experiences which was helpful to share between us, but I was very disheartened by those who didn't know enough about it or want to bother understanding enough about it, those who trivialised it with the usual which we've all heard before: "oh, it's not as if they're hurting anyone", "all religions are like that", etc.

Needless to say, I cancelled my next dentist's appointment but they called the day after it was scheduled, denying I'd cancelled it and threatening me with charging me for it anyway.
Payment would've meant contact in person, which is usual with dentists but as they denied the cancellation I think it was an attempt to attract me back the surgery. I refused to pay after which they stopped calling, but this could be connected to another incident shortly afterwards.

We were walking through the city centre one afternoon when a stranger offered myself and my child a lift in his car. When I refused, he asked for my number which I also refused to give him, but he wrote his address down and gave it to me, which struck me as a silly thing for a bothersome person to do, so I took it in case I needed to contact the police about him. He then left but when we got onto our bus home he got on at the next stop, only getting off when he saw us get off, following us through our gate up the path to our front door, by which time I was banging on it as hard as my fists would let me to alert my (now ex) partner, who told him in no uncertain terms to "vacate the grounds" immediately. I contact the police who visited to take a statement but never heard anything more of it.

Anyway, I do feel kind of bad for this story being so epic - it's not even as if I've been in Scientology for decades like some - but I did feel the need to warn others about this tactic because unfortunately, it seems you can never let your guard down even somewhere which is supposed to help you. On a more positive note though, I seem to have since been cured of my fear of dental injections, maybe because when I think of how the alternative could have turned out, they don't seem so bad after all...

tl;dr: just compare these 2 address and see for yourself...

12th address down in 2rd post [ocmb.xenu.net]

The Dental Group [thedentalgroup.co.uk]

Anonymeep · Apr 1, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

Wow! thanks for writing this - no, it's not a story of decades in the cult, but it's a perfect illustration of how insidious Scientology can be. What a despicable way to gain members/money.

EastAnon · Apr 3, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

They seem to make a habit of this:

http://www.thewealthydentist.com/surveyresults/24_BadDentalConsultants_Results.htm

Scientology (yes, Scientology)

* "I got invited to a teaser meeting and returned the next week to experience an aggressive attempt to humiliate me into signing on to an outrageously expensive no-end-in-sight series of coaching meetings. Not only that, it would eventually involve a religious change." (Arizona dentist)
* "This may not sound like a horror story, but it was a very expensive lesson to do my due diligence a little better. I wanted a consultant who would come into my office to make a 'diagnosis' and recommendations. After the payment, I learned that the approach was strictly L. Ron Hubbard – an approach I had previously experienced and rejected as not appropriate for my management style and practice profile." (Pennsylvania dentist)
* "Watch out for any of the 'consultants' who tout the Scientology writings of L. Ron Hubbard." (California dentist)
* "What I thought was consulting was a front for Scientology." (New York dentist)
* "Had a group essentially using consulting as a 'come on' to recruit people to their New Age religion." (Illinois dentist)
* "Hollander. All promises and no delivery. Waste of time and money. Scientology-based; proselytized my staff." (Oregon dentist)
* "It's the L. Ron Hubbard/Scientology ones that drive me crazy." (Connecticut dentist)
* "I am poorer and no wiser from the experience with Hollander. Hubbard was just too out there for my sleepy Amish area. Very little positive plans, just a lot of theory. Waste of time and money." (Pennsylvania dentist)
* "Scientology-based consultants. Scary! (Hollander/ Sterling). When I tried to get out of Sterling, losing a HUGE deposit, they told me, threateningly, 'You're making a big mistake.' What a bunch of fruitcakes." (North Carolina dentist)
* "Scientology influenced – some weird people!" (Mississippi dentist)

anon-and-on-and-anon · Apr 3, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

username.unavailable;92098 said:

tl;dr: just compare these 2 address and see for yourself...

12th address down in 2rd post [ocmb.xenu.net]

The Dental Group [thedentalgroup.co.uk]

Hmm... bastards!
There's a "Jeff O Carroll" (Dentist's name) in the Completions database.

http://www.truthaboutscientology.com/stats/by-name/j/jeff-o-carroll.html

Spot · Apr 3, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

That explains a bit about how "sterling management" and similar groups promise dentists that they'll "Increase their receipts 300000%" and shit like that.

Fucking crazy.

Marijuana · Apr 4, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

That is really very creepy. It wouldn't even seem like anything evil to people who were ignorant of what they actually do, which is every more scary. To think of all the vulnerable people who've been sucked in..

username.unavailable · Apr 4, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

Wow - thanks for all the replies

anon-and-on-and-anon;129775 said:

Hmm... bastards!
There's a "Jeff O Carroll" (Dentist's name) in the Completions database.

http://www.truthaboutscientology.com/stats/by-name/j/jeff-o-carroll.html

Here with his wife, the proprieter:

Giselle & Jeff O'Carroll

and her own:

Giselle O'Carroll

Anonygnome · Apr 9, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

I'm currently looking for a dentist.

How do I avoid this?

Ask if they use Sterling Management? I'm scared of asking bluntly about the office religion. Don't want my phone number namefagged.

Spot · Apr 13, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

google the dentists' name, and the word scientology together.

Example:

Dentist, Neil Woods.

Google: Neil Woods scientologist

IF you find one of these pages for him/her:
Neil Woods - Scientology Service Completions | Truth About Scientology Statistics Project

Then do a little more googling to make sure that's the right person. In this case it is, Neil Woods and his wife have a dental practice, and they were two of the scilons taking pictures of anon at the DC protest on 2/10.

Incognitoast · Apr 15, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

Thank you for the story. I quite enjoyed it. The "Close your eyes and imagine.." is a nasty way to bring someone into a trance without them knowing. It's a hidious abuse of the skill.

I'm a hypnotist myself and I have had to spend many hours fixing problems that ethicless hypnotists have done or even those with the very bare knowlage has done.

I really grinds my gears that people abuse the skill.

NoIAmSpartacus · Apr 20, 2008

Re: Dentists, Scientology and Me

Some time after I got involved in the anti-Scientology movement, I read about their "Sterling Management" front group and how they heavily targeted dentist offices. This reminded me of something.

Several years earlier, a woman in our church asked for prayer in finding a new job. She worked as a dental hygenist, and her boss was requiring the entire office to take some "classes" that really sent up red flags with her.

Knowing what I now know, I can't imagine those "classes" NOT being Scientology.

(and the next week in church, she reported finding a new job at the same pay, but with a shorter commute.)

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Dentists, Scientology and Me

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