Does protesting actually work? Message from an ex-Scientologist

Discussion in 'Scientology and Anonymous' started by Jeff Jacobsen, Aug 26, 2015.

  1. Jeff Jacobsen Member

    "I was in training at Flag in 98 and 99 and I saw the protesters then. It must have been you all. I saw someone walking around with a coffin and it got me curious. I saw the name Lisa McPherson (I did not know anything about her back then) and it got me to start wondering... it started my path out. Just thought you should know. People do see the signs and read them and talk about them on the inside."
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  2. Quentinanon Member

    Those were the Lisa McPherson Trust protesters and it is to your credit that you re-examined scientology because of that. I think that possibility is the reason why the harassment/propaganda/dirty tricks arm of the cult, OSA, goes to extremes to Fair Game protesters.
    Does protesting scientology "work"? Most scientologists are not like you and engage in heavy thought stopping which seems to be the whole purpose of the subject. It is certainly a civil outlet for repulsion to the criminal activities and human rights abuses within the cult. If a scientologist wakes up, then there is one less slave for the cult to exploit.
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  3. ty Always good to see you. Any updates would like.
  4. DeathHamster Member

    LMT didn't set up until 2000, just saying.
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  5. RightOn Member

    Someone said that Sparrow was the reason she got out.
    And I have heard other stories of people seeing protestors and then looking farther into it, although I can't remember who or when
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  6. John Duff Member

    Thank you and congrats. :)
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  7. amaX Member

    A Feshbach woman quit because of a sign that a Clearwater Cell protester was carrying back in the early days of Chanology. I actually found a picture of the sign in our picture collection and had someone show it to her.
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  8. ravenanon Member

    It depends if you limit the scope to help as in only those inside the cult. While protesting we have informed many people who then don't join etc when they stop by to pick up information and talk to us. I've talked to a few churches, etc too

    For me protesting also means other things besides holding a sign on the street. I've already started mailing letters to various organizations in Sandy Springs about the cults criminal behavior. If we can keep the drug free marshals, etc out of a classroom I'm calling win.
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  9. BigBeard Member

    '98/'99 timeframe with a coffin sounds like the, more or less, annual Lisa McPherson remembrance protests the folks inhabiting a.r.s. would do. Went to a couple of those. $cilons mashing toes and trying to blow out candles one year, bunches of them bused in and marching around the police building chanting, 'Sid Klein, what are your crimes?' (He was police chief at the time.) another.

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  10. Ogsonofgroo Member

    The seeds of doubt sown by IRL pickets/flyering etc. has proven to be quite effective imho. There are indeed quite a few accounts of staff breaking their cognitive dissonance, a visit and read over at Ethercat's fine exit survey affirms this quite well, don't expect any but the most die-hard/brain-dead scilons to bother even having a look-see, but it is a good night to be spent reading the over 300 posts from those who have managed to escape the clutches of ol' fucktard LRon's mind destroying crime machine. I love that there are so many trolls calling 'It didn't work!' "Its all useless!' 'Bawww-baw-baw, you is all so mean (blah-blah-blaw ad-nausea )'.

    Better than the boob-tube and Dorito's :p
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  11. finnishandy Member

    They sure do. I recall couple of protest when I was in the cult. I felt really afraid of them and I don't like to be afraid, so I confronted the cause and the cause was the cult itself.
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  12. konrad2 Member

    Protesting does work, but I think it is important to have signs that communicate well. 95% or more of Scientologists have never heard of Xenu. My boss in OSA would only use OTs when handling situations where there was a reference to upper levels. Very few people make it to OT III and it is then that you discover Lord Xenu.I am thinking of developing signs with short phrases and important info like:
    The Church of $cientology spends 150 $ to make an E-meter and then sells it to you for 4 000 $ why ?
    The Church of Scientology raises tens of thousands of dollars when there a natural catastrophe and then instead of helping anyone they send a team from Gold to film volunteer Ministers smiling with yellow shirts far from where the real action is.
    Why is it that Miscavige's father, his brother and his niece, his personal secretary and his deputy have all left ?
    How is it possible that if only 10 % of the population is suppressive, Misscavige has declared 90 % of the staff appointed by Hubbard himself in the Old Saint-Hill ?
    The phrases are too long, this is the first draft as it comes, but I hope that some of this questions will plant a seed in clams' minds and make them doubt.
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  13. amaX Member

    A Sea Org member inside the building where SO took classes while at Flag heard the Clearwater Cell chanting the old toll free number to get help to blow and realized what he was being told about us was a lie.

    It was enough to wake him up. He immediately started trying to save money and he did blow.

    He's married now and very happy.
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  14. Django Member

    Didja ever price a custom Ducati...?
  15. konrad2 Member

    Miscavige and Tom Cruise got theirs customised with slave labour. The money they used to buy them (at least Miscavige) came not from work, but from tax free donations from scamology's Kool-aid heavy drinkers.
  16. Only if lulz are to had it makes a difference
  17. xander meehan Member

    You are always so damn funny, I always reading your posts. You are very cool.
    Saxxx (Xander)
  18. xander meehan Member

    I am seriously hoping you all mightconsider a little job for Anony, if you wantto. Here it is. I would like
  19. xander meehan Member

    I would like to dig up all of the research on the original Jim and Tammy Faye Baker prosecutions. I would like to then see if Dart Xander would be willing to read said prosecution information. If Jim Baker can go to federal prison for this type of behavior I would like to understand why Miscreant Midget isn't Federally prosecuted, and sent on vacation to the stone Palace. If Darth Xander can't do it, maybe we should go find Graham Berry and see if he'll give it a read, how is that for an idea? Comments anyone, please?
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  20. konrad2 Member

    What were the Jim and Tammy Faye Baker prosecutions? I don't remember these cases Were they legal cases in the US? What was the date? Concerning the possibility of prosecuting Miscavige, I think there are a few facts to consider: 1) The 1rst amendment gives carte blanche to any religion to abuse its followers to an extent that would be impossible in civil society. The Headleys lost their case, Mike Pattinson lost his case, the Lisa MacPherson case ended up in a settlement and in putting Minton in a tight spot. 2) Litigation against the richest cult in the world is not that easy. They will explore every nook and cranny of the legal maze and use it with utmost perversity, e.g. the anti SLAPP motion in Texas against Monique Rathbun and the use of 22 lawyers against her. They don't care about winning but about bleeding you dry like in the case against the CAN. They don't care about spending millions in settlements, what happened to Nibs (L. Ron Hubbard jr), David Mayo, Vicky Aznaran, the 2 private detectives who followed Pat Broeker for nearly 20 years, Debbie Cook and so many others 3) In the old days there was a more clear paper trail that could determine liability. Now a days, if Misc decides something, he is not going to issue an order on paper signing with his name. He lives in a bubble in the outer fringes of Wogland but he has an army of Rondroids who will come forth and tell the "truth" for him, like the "inch wives" saying there had not been any violence at the INT Base. 4) No one in politics or in the administration will do anything about Scientology unless it would become safe and fashionable to do so. In that case only, they would be brave enough to do something about it. 5) In Florida and California Scientology has infiltrated so successfully the police and the legal system that it would be much better to have Misc on trial in New York or in Texas and even better, in Canada, in Norway, in France or in Germany.
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  21. konrad2 Member

    I forgot one detail. the FBI stopped the investigation on human trafficking in Scientology because what we call slave labour in the US legal system is called "volunteer work" as a member of a religious organisation. The Headleys unfortunately tried that line and it didn't work.
  22. xander meehan Member

    That's a really good point. It seriously amazes me, and has for years, that if anyone else had done anything like this they would be sitting in jail right now.
  23. konrad2 Member

    Yes, you are right, but this is a vestige of the culture in the USA. There were many religious wars all over Europe with the development of splitting Christian movements.after Luther and Calvin. In 1572, 10,000 protestants were killed in the wake the night of the Saint Bartholomew, following the assassination of Admiral Coligny in Paris. Across the channel, in England, Thomas More and Mary Stuart lost their heads because of their Catholic faith. In the France of Louis the XIV, protestant pastors would be set to the galleys,The list of atrocities is long and it encompasses the whole continent and hundreds of years of history. Many believers fled Europe and found refuge in the Dutch and English colonies of the New World. Anglicans, Dutch Calvinists, English Puritans, English Catholics, Scottish Presbyterians, French Huguenots, German and Swedish Lutherans, as well as Quakers, Mennonites, Amish, Moravians and Jews of various nationalities settled in the New World because they could find a new life and be let in peace to practice their religion. This was the background that led to the principle of freedom of religion and its protection in the American Constitution. Is this principle outdated in the face of the abuses of a commercial racketing cult like the "Church" of Scientology which practices human trafficking in the name of religion? That is the real question.
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  24. anon8109 Member

    The problem is when religion and money are mixed, and religious figures live in luxury.

    The Catholic pope gets to have not only his own mansion, but his own city complete with a private army, surrounded by priceless artworks, with his own private bank.

    All any US flimflam artist, including Miscavige, has to do to justify their own "religious" greed is point to that as an example of what is considered mainstream and acceptable for a religious leader.
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  25. xander meehan Member

    That was an outstanding post... It is absolute beauty in its historical accuracy, and extremely straight forward view. I am very thankful for this post. It illustrates so much of what Anony really fights for.IMHO. Its not necessarily if you have a specific faith, or theological underpinnings, its really about freedom of expression, freedom of opinion, freedom of speech, freedom to assemble, and of course the freedom to worship how you choose. This also clearly defines the foundation of the right and freedom to "DEMONSTRATE and in real terms "ACT and define one' self as a "VOICE of DISSENT.""

    Yet for me, the CO$ will never be an actual Church. It is full complete misrepresentation to define the Scienos as any form of theological belief.

    Thanks once again for this outstanding post.
    Saxxx (Xander)
  26. xander meehan Member

    So well stated... Boy I couldn't agree with you more..
  27. furball Member

    To address the original topic as to whether or not protesting actually works: Of course protesting works. Have we not been paying attention? :) Is it a one shot cures all scenario? Of course not. But then nobody ever said that it was. It is just another line of approach. If it only saves one or a few people, it was all worth it. But we know it has saved many, many more. And so, the fight continues.

    Congrats to all that have escaped. Your life is yours now. Go live it.
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  28. konrad2 Member

    To answer the question “does protest work?” I think there is a previous question to be addressed and it is: the straw that breaks the camel’s back? Well, it will be something different for every single individual, but the common factor is the accumulation.

    Scientology is a lot about mind control by misdirecting attention. So when you see something that is not OK, you tend to think it is the exception and that you shouldn’t have negative thoughts about it since there are so many good things in Scientology and you’ve had so many wins, that this outweighs the thing that upset you, so you disregard this fact and keep on in present time, here and now and on the way for Thursday’s 2 pm stats and the salvaging the planet. So things keep piling up like:

    There is something negative happening that is in disagreement with an ideal situation, like you are sent to the gulag and you know you are innocent but Scientology is supposed to have a better system of justice.

    You are working for the greatest ecclesiastical leader in the Galaxy and he jumps on you like a madman and beats you up for no reason and you know Scientology should bring people to higher states or awareness and understanding, but you don’t feel understood in the least.

    One of your friends has gone past the state of clear and in on the higher levels, he is supposed to be cause on matter energy space and time and his mind is supposed to master his body, but he dies of cancer soon after attesting OT VII.

    In an event you are told the giving thousands of booklets of the “The Way To Happiness” has resulted in a miraculous drop of the crime rate in Colombia. You happen to go to Colombia, you are escorted by Colombian security personnel, come back on the plain with a special forces officer and you find out no one of the people in law enforcement you have been acquainted with, knows remotely anything about Scientology. They all know it is former President Uribe and the Colombian army who busted the drug cartels and the FARC guerrillas.

    You have been told that by giving money for the Ideal Org, people will come in droves and then you drop in at the Ideal Org in Madrid, London, or Berlin and find the place is empty.

    You are told that the expansion of Scientology statistics for this year are X 47, but you drop in at your local org and see the same old staff that have been there for decades and some of their kids, you also see a couple of people in introductory courses and 4 or 6 in more advanced ones. You remember that 10 years ago there was more activity and 20 or 30 years ago, the place was booming. It just doesn’t make sense.

    You work with Scientologists and Scientology companies and they owe you money, you know they belong to the “most ethical group” in the planet, but they have given unbelievable sums of money to the IAS instead of paying you back and now you are in dire straits because you have to rely on Scientology justice and you can’t sue them, so you file for bankruptcy.

    It doesn’t matter what it is, but in protesting, if you continue just telling the truth and piling up simple facts, one day there will be the straw that will break the camel’s back and one more person will walk out of the cult and start looking for the real answers.

    Konrad 2
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  29. xander meehan Member

    Very very very well said.... we do it a little at a time... as much as one person at a time.... we continue the struggle... we all stay in the fight for those that fought and have fallen... For me personally, my goal in coming back is hopefully to generate some really long term financial support for Anony, and to step up the fight... too bring a much much higher level of game... I have had to live with these Scienos all up in my face since the mid 70s.... They started this fight ... not me... its not just Lisa, Kaja, the young children, all of the families ruined, there are as all of you know, so many other deaths... That's the other part of it... It always good to be able to put faces with those names... lest we forget.... The beauty of Anony... is we will not forget... we will not let that happen... That's why I love all of you that have kept WWP Alive and functioning... There is still a place...
  30. xander meehan Member

    Very beautiful post.... Truth is what matters...
  31. xander meehan Member

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