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EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

Discussion in 'Celebrity News' started by Sponge, Aug 5, 2009.

  1. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    The Catholic Church is not a cult and it does not have policies and teachings which mandate child abuse. Stop being so fail.
  2. Antagone Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Oh nice try there but don't put words into my mouth.
  3. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    If you can't defend yourself, you can't defend yourself. No worries.
  4. Herro Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    You're saying that all scientologists are a danger to children simply because they're scientologists. I'm sorry, but that's straight up bigotry. As for backing up my statement, your own words are doing just fine. Also note I was only saying that you, are being bigoted.

    So then you think that scientology deserves its tax breaks?



    Interesting that you claim this isn't bigotry by putting scientologists on the same level as pedophiles and nazis.
  5. Antagone Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Challenge me on what I said, not on what you think, or want, me to have said. If you want my views on Catholic schools then toddle off and start a new thread or PM me.
  6. Antagone Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    I'm saying that anyone who supports a cult where the abuse of children is endemic should not be allowed to hold a position where they are responsible for the welfare of children. Scientologists are not allowed to question Hubbard's teachings and have to blindly obey them so that would be a conflict of interest when it comes to being in loco parentis of a minor.

    That is not bigotry Herro, it's common sense.
  7. Vir Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Are you saying Scientology isn't a religion, you bigot? You just don't want people to success. Scientology works and it helps people.

    The point is that it is Scientology. If we assume, arguendo, that Scientology is a religion, then this is a religious school. If we assume, arguendo, that Scientology is not a religion, then this is not a religious school but it is still a Scientology school.

    It does matter, because it will be used by Scientologists under license from Scientology in this school. They would most likely be declared and thrown out of Scientology if they were to allow non-standard tech, and also lose their ABLE license and be sued by Moxon and Kobrin. There are allowances made for celebrities, but there is nothing suggesting that such allowances are made here.

    If they are not Scientologists in good standing, then this would be some kind of Freezone school, which would be pretty funny.

    Correct.

    Incorrect, or meaningless statement. It's not "study tech" unless it's the study technology made by L. Ron Hubbard. This happens to be the same as the study tech used in Scientology.

    And the point is that it's not divorced at all. Scientology is still sleeping in Study Tech's master bedroom, but goes to hide in the closet when the parents come over.
  8. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Your arguments are getting tired, old and more to the point silly now. When there was thread about this a few weeks ago, I didn't agree with you but I understood where you were coming from. This time now Will & Jada's direct actions speak (SHOUT) louder than their lies told last year. And calling people bigots because they are concerned about children being sucked into a cult while being lied to about the true purpose of the schools agenda is rather disgusting.
  9. Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Maybe not in a school that doesn't use study tech as it's basis. But in one that does use study tech a scientologist teacher would be compelled by KSW to make it go right (even if that means fixing the watered down version of study tech by reduction to it's elements)!
  10. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    I'd be happy to apply those comments to the Catholic Church when you can provide evidence for the assertion that abuse of children (and adults) is as pervasive, as systematic, and as codified into church canon, as is the case in Scientology.

    People who report abuses within the Catholic Church -
    most frequently report that they felt they were singled out for "special" treatment. They were abused or mistreated to a greater extent than (some of) their peers; though the ones who *do* report abuse tend to claim there were other cases worse than theirs- its not necessarily supported.

    People who report abuses within the CoS -
    more frequently report that *everyone* among their peers was given similar treatment. Different people had different personal responses to the abuse, but in general the abusers aren't reported as being choosy.

    In the Catholic sphere, they (guys in charge) tend to tell you the rules in advance, though the rules may change, and may be interpreted differently by different admins. "ignorance is not an excuse" for sin, but sins committed due to ignorance are rarely judged as harshly as ones done with full knowledge.

    In the CoS sphere, its frequently the case that you're not "qualified" to be allowed to know the rules, or what's expected of you; while you are still expected to adhere to them. It's always your fault if you flunk.

    tl;dr

    Both bureaucratic systems have significant systemic problems.
    One has a bureaucratic (and kludgy) mechanism for reform- to address those problems.
    One has simpler policy on reform: smash squirrels
  11. Vir Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    No. The argument which you are desperately trying to ignore is that study tech is claimed to be religious by Scientology when it suits them, and claimed to be secular when it suits them.

    An old lady on sleeping pills, a nazi in a murderous rage, a 2 month old baby, or me when I'm druk, should all not be allowed to drive a car. That doesn't necessarily place us on the same "level", only sharing our unsuitability and danger potential behind the wheel. Same with teaching kids - the pedophile, the Scientologist in good standing and comm with RTC, the nazi indoctrinator, or a creationsit science teacher, all share the characteristic that they have something other than the child's best interest in mind. In their own minds, they might think they are doing what is best for the child, but it is up to society and the parents to not allow them to have a free run. That is a separate issue to "levels", because I can be friends with a Scientologist or a creationist, but never with a nazi or a practicing pedophile.
  12. themadhair Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    That just isn’t true Herro. Unfortunately, unless you have studied Scientology in some detail, the religious nature of it isn’t easily spotted. To give an example, in studytech you only use three methods of wordclearing (method 3, 7 and 9) – the others involve an emeter and are left out for the charade. The concepts of mass, m/u and gradients are squarely based upon the avoidance of ARC breaks and the Scientology understanding of MEST. The edifice of studytech is predicated upon the equivocating of understanding with acceptance (in Scientology terms making it reality) which is a distinctly religious idea and not an educational one.

    The analogy of intelligent design someone else brought up is very apt here. What the folks at the Disco ‘Tute did was to systematically go through their textbook ‘Pandas and People’ and replace ‘god’, ‘creator’ and ‘creation’ with ‘intelligent agent’, ‘intelligent designer’ and ‘intelligent design’. Studytech is even more barefaced in its faux-secularisation. Problem is that people just aren’t familiar enough with Scientology doctrines to recognise it. This is what needs to be hammered home.
  13. YAHRLY Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    BUAHAHAHAHAHA
    MPB told you Socal guys you got handled over a year ago, and it looks like you got handled!
  14. RHill Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Yes it does. What matters is that Scientologists are teaching in school using what they consider Scientology scriptures, with the goal of proselytizing, as per their religious duties. Your opinion of Study Tech is irrelevant. What matters is:

    1. The Church of Scientology is on the record that "Study Tech"'s purpose is proselytism, and
    2. It is easily demonstrated that "Study Tech" comes right from Scientology scriptures
    3. The teachers are Scientologists
    Thus, any harm from this willful misrepresentation/deceit is actionable, and Church of Scientology knows it very well. That's why they rather settle when their deceptive recruiting is exposed in court.

    Ponder this:
  15. Zak McKracken Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    If (hypothetically) Scientologists were trained and taught to lie-
    would it be fair to call them liars? Or would that be bigotry?

    If (hypothetically) some Scientologists were trained and taught to lie, and some were not-
    would it be fair to say 'all Scientologists are liars'?

    If, as I suspect is usually the case, it is difficult or impossible to tell at a glance which poisonous LRH teachings they have absorbed and taken to heart, and which they haven't- making broad statements about Scientologists is probably doomed to fail.
    But.

    This makes it hard for some of us to know how much trust we can give them.

    I can't say that NO Scientologists are qualified to be teachers;
    but if they can't talk about their beliefs, they can't provide us the information we would need to make a fair evaluation.
  16. YAHRLY Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School


    oh look a cancer with no concept of total war...
  17. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    this story was linked earlier in thread by someone (thx)...and though from 1997, its a great article and I would love to have the LA Weekly do a followup.

    Scientology v. Education - The Scam of "Study Technology" : <b>LA Weekly</b><br />The Learning Cure

    Here's what the unnamed 'prominent university professor' had to say about the link between study tech and scientology:

    The article goes on:

    Anyone know if Rena Weinberg and Teresa Posner are still in scientology. It has been 12 years after all...

  18. RHill Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    And where in "Intelligent Design" teachings can one read that "Jesus was running around with dinosaurs"?

    *crickets*

    ID is about nudging the young minds to come to imply that there has to be a "designer." The rest will follow eventually, they will become more ready to take in the Bible. Exactly what Scientology is doing with the various covert Scientology doctrines in Study Tech.
  19. Herro Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    You're skipping the part where you show that scientology is being taught in the school.
    But scientology isn't in the curriculum. The kids aren't even being taught why study tech is supposed to work. It doesn't matter if they KSW because this little chunk of the tech isn't bound up with the rest of scientology- at least not as it's being used here.

    Just because it's the same study tech doesn't mean that it can only be used for the purposes of religious teaching or indoctrination. For instance, does practicing yoga make one Hindi? Does practicing Therravadda meditation techniques make one a Buddhist?

    Again, you're giving into bigotry. What you think is rational concern is blind fear of the Other.

    So what if they keep study tech working? There's no teaching of scientology in this application of the tech.

    Agreed. But I fail to see why this is relevant.

    Again, you're assuming that a scientologist just can't help himself because of his beliefs. You're saying a scientologist is likely a danger to children because of his status as a scientologist. It's rationalized bigotry. At the very least it's stereotypical thinking.

    Ok, but as far as the kids know they're just looking up words they don't understand and getting hands on learning. How does that magically lead them to scientology?

    Ok, that's what they like to do. But this still doesn't make the Smiths scientologists nor does it make this a scientologist school.

    You still can't seem to grasp the fact that I can take issue with internal justifications while still not objecting to action being taken.
  20. themadhair Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    QFT. People have this mental picture about Scientology study techniques that expect them to be immediately recognisable. The reality is much more subtle than that, but no less of a worry.
  21. YAHRLY Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    yeah

    compartmentalizing

    what kind of people do that again?
  22. Herro Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    People that don't just think in black and white dichotomies.
  23. themadhair Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Maybe you should reread what I wrote. The techniques of studytech get children to think in terms of Scientology concepts as I explained.

    Have you read any of the study tech books (such as 'Learning how to learn')? Have you compared them to Scientology doctrines? Are you playing devil's advocate or just nay-saying here without doing any fucking research to evidence the contrary?
  24. Sponge Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Like a lot of frontages of the cult, the purpose, or A purpose, of study tech (which is unavoidably attached to scientology as a matter of licensing) is for the cult to get a foot in the door of establishment. They will go as far as they can go with it. Yesterdays news showed that they just took another big step.

    The argument as to whether introducing study tech is a good thing or a bad thing, in any proportion, is done already. It's a "do not want". The question is how to convince [STRIKE]Herro[/STRIKE] the populace most easily.
  25. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    No, its common sense.
  26. Antagone Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    My goodness Herro, you're really surprising me today! I always thought you prided yourself on being rational and yet here you are seemingly claiming to have super psychic powers which enable you to know what I'm thinking!

    To save you further strain on your ESP, I'll explain. I have no 'blind fear of the Other'. Indeed I'd have no worries if children learned about Scientology as part of their religious education curriculum.

    No Herro, what I do object to is people who actively support a cult where children are abused and where 14-year-olds are put into full-time work at the expense of their education holding a position where they are in charge of minors and I certainly wouldn't call them professionals if they are unable to set their personal beliefs aside in the workplace.
  27. fitch2000 Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Are you a lawyer by any chance? Just wondering....

    What you don't seem to be getting it that scientology is a way of thinking and learning. Study tech with no critical thinking allowed or involved. It is a crime to doubt anything you are told is true. (And keep doing something over and over til you make 100% sounds like total brainwashing to me, kinda like staring at someone else for hours doing nothing, kinda makes your brain go numb I bet.)

    Study tech is "educational dianetics" is dianetics is scientology. For you to want to pick it apart and say well this piece isn't bad makes no sense Herro. It is all scientology/dianetics.
  28. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    No, you missed it. Study tech is a basic practice of Scientology, and you can just re-read the thread.

    It is being used as intended, by Scientologists in good standing and comm with RTC, which means that this IS Scientology. True they omit mentioning the word "Scientology" in the books the students get, but just removing the word doesn't turn the 100% standard KSW practiced study tech into "not-Study Tech".

    Since I don't know anything about yoga and Therravadda meditation I'm just going to admit that I don't know anything about those, rather than pretend that I do and yap on about them. (hint hint)

    I do know that some martial arts do require you to accept some philosophies from Eastern religions, but this is not hidden and lied about by the teachers. When they say it's compatible with being a Christian, I can trust them becaue they don't routinely lie to people .

    I think you need to word-clear Scientology. Do you use it only to apply to openly teaching about thetans and body-thetans, or to the entire set of practices and beliefs? How about if they thaught about thetans without saying that it was Scientology, would you still think it was "not Scientology". You need to look up your misunderstood, and it seem to be "Scientology".

    Because it destroys your/NVLA's whole argument.

    Notice that I qualified my statement by saying a "Scientologist in good standing and comm with RTC". I'm not talking about people who just privately belive in Hubbard here, but people whose lives are ruled over in totality by David "Slappy Squirrel" Miscavige. That is a huge loyalty conflict, and Scientologists in good standing will choose Scientology over their family, friends or workplace every time - that is why they are in "good standing" with the "church".

    Now, other types of "Scientologists" like freezoners or Scientologists who are off lines and not using licensed Study Tech - that is a whole other discussion. I'm not going to conclude in that prematurely, but I'm inclined not to be too worried about them being teachers.

    LOL WUT?

    We're not arguing whether it's all bad or not. We're arguing whether New Village Leadership Academy is lying to the public and the parents. And they are.
  29. Vir Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    That anon was me. Also cocks
  30. mrfyde Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    To do that is to assume that Scientology can be defined other than things written by LRH. It can't look at the Tommy Davis interview on CNN he couldn't even define Scientology.


    KSW is described here as the part of Scientology that is "brainwashing". And although KSW is not the only part of scientology that "brainwashes" people it alone could do it.

    What are the religious parts of Scientology ?



    Perhaps if in any of your posts you gave hint that you are aware of what the program taught people might not be putting up a fight.

    I do wonder if you enjoy the attention you get / demand when people have to derail a threads to educate you about what you are talking about.

    So what if they keep study tech working? There's no teaching of scientology in this application of the tech.

    Well Study Tech doesn't work, it is basically dog training. It not only introduces LRH as a genius/humanitarian/ guru that equates him to Einstein but trains them like dogs to comply with out question.

    Then look up every word in the dictionary you must have gone past one that you don't understand.


    It isn't the person it is what (and actually more "how" ) the person is teaching.


    LRH is considered a great humanitarian and one of the great minds in history.

    Define what makes a Scientologist.
  31. AnonymousNow Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    There is a distinction between rightfully playing the devil's advocate and simply raising specious, unsupported, and self contradictory arguments intended to derail threads.. Time and time again. The mods here seem to have strange problems determing who is who in this respect. This comment is not directed to the poster immediately above this post, of course, unless that is herro.
  32. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    This ^^^
  33. ARC Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    1: Herro stayed on topic this time.
    2: You didn't report him. (Learn to use this thing here: [IMG])
    3: I'd love to see him come back and address the questions he hasn't answered yet.
  34. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    If we didn't have so many people feeding a troll then they would starve.

    Srsly - call bullshit people if you feel you must then move on.
  35. mrfyde Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Sometimes it is more satisfying to see a troll choke instead of starve.
  36. RHill Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Let's say...
    1. a school brands its Theravada-based curriculum as 'secular';
    2. the 'secular' school has teachers/personels whose religious beliefs are deeply rooted in Theravada;
    3. many or all the teachers are members in good standing with the Church of Theravada International;
    4. the Church of Theravada International is on the record stating that the purpose of its 'secular' school is to recruit new Theravada converts;
    5. the Church of Theravada International is on the record stating that the purpose of its 'secular' school is to grant legitimacy to Theravada and its founders
    6. the school uses Theravada books bought from Four Noble Truths Publications Inc., an integrated auxiliary of the Church of Theravada International;
    7. the 'secular' school has to pay license fees to Totally Secular Corp. who in return pays license fees to the Totally Not Theravada Social Betterment Corp. for the Theravada-based curriculum;
    8. Totally Not Theravada Social Betterment Corp. funnel most of its fund to the Church of Theravada International, while enforcing the use of materials from Four Noble Truths Publications Inc.;
    9. Strangely, Totally Not Theravada Social Betterment Corp. sometimes describe itself as a religious entity to some levels of government;
    10. The Theravada-based curriculum describes how the founder studied math and engineering at a prominent university, somehow failing to mention that the founder actually dropped out with extremely poor grades;
    11. The Theravada-based curriculum describes the Theravada founder as having 'departed its body' at some point in the past;
    12. the school keeps emphasizing over and over that its curriculum has nothing to do with Theravada;

    Yep, Theravada-based curriculum, totally secular, they say so!

    Playing devil advocate is totally pointless if done at the expense of intellectual honesty.
  37. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    I disagree with that statement. But there is a difference between playing Devil's Advocate and just being a contrarian.
  38. YAHRLY Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    Herro is not a troll!!!

    he is a contrarian, even with help he can't pull of a decent troll

    or CAN he?
  39. Anonymous Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    notrly
  40. LilDebbie Member

    Re: EXCLUSIVE: Will and Jada Fire Head of Their School

    study tech is scientology. they're teaching study tech in the school. ergo, they're teaching scientology in the school.

    awaiting your pathetic attempts to demonstrate that study tech is not scientology.

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