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How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

Discussion in 'GoldBase' started by Anonymous, Mar 4, 2009.

  1. Anonymous Member

    How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    I might be asking stupid questions in the wrong place so if Mods would you like to move this to the Think Tank and or Dome be my guest.

    How could we suggest an ordinance in Riverside County to:

    a) Limit the size and usage of barbed wire (surrounding a cult complex)

    b) Create a program that if anyone feels threatened of being harmed they can report to the county sheriff's dept to be picked up and receive protection for certain amount of time.

    c) Require health inspections for community living and eating spaces.

    d) County wide census.

    So the question is: How do we get them to consider an ordinance, and what other ideas do we have for one ?
  2. Anon123456 Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    tell the police to temporarily mark the actual property line in yellow. measure 30' back from that and paint a red line. problem fuckin solved.
  3. restim Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    I suggest contacting Bob Buster and asking him to introduce it. You never know...
  4. AngryGayPope1 Member

    That's a good idea

    Which is why it won't happen in riverside!

    The ex-cop at the mtg told me Riverside is getting more and more big brotherish and passing laws like "paint your house this color - or else" "no chain link fences in front yards" "no parking your own vehicle certain places on your own property."

    And if you wanted to protest at the supers houses that's tougher now.
  5. mrfyde Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    so they are going to protest in the middle of the hi way ?

    also the OP is not about 884 it is about using the same process the cult used to help the people who live at GOLD.

    I think Bob Buster might be willing to hear from people in his district. But I doubt the average guy in Kansas would have much sway.

    Llera (or what ever the lady with the braided pony tail's name is) mentioned that she would be able to vote for Bob Buster. But she seems more likely to be against ordinances than for them. She is there because she wants the right to picket in front of pedophiles houses but she might dislike Stone enough to suggest it.
  6. Anon123456 Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    no... just mark the shit clearly.
  7. mrfyde Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Maybe you have a better understanding than me. Still OP did not mention 884. and your suggestion was off topic.

    It seems clear that passing ordinances is easier than stopping them from going thru with out local support. Are you certain that gold property is >30 feet from the road?
  8. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    I think you've overlooked the obvious. That's precisely why the cult doesn't want the property line marked.
  9. mrfyde Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Then please explain. I believe that they do not want the property line marked however they do seem to have taken over the "sidewalk" space. As 884 (that is not the topic of this thread) defines. However if the sidewalk is < 30 feet the ordinance is unclear about where protesters can stand. and people would have to stand across the street. However my understanding is that CoS has been buying up the houses across the street for years. (I could be wrong on that point)
  10. Anon123456 Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    where ever the property line is, it should be public domain. even if they dont mark it they should say"here is the line"
  11. mrfyde Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Correct me if I am wrong but they have not done that have they ? and do you beleive that will happen ?

    Is your understanding that the side of the road is "fine" and that protestors can stand where the Marks' where arrested ?

    Again sorry to the OP, here is the topic of this thread:

  12. kitfisto Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    How bout a picket at Stones pharmacy??

    He apparently hasn't gotten the memo which states "WE RUN THIS"
  13. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Whatever you do, don't block the egret!
    blockedegret.jpg
  14. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Does AO live in Riverside county ? I doubt that they would be jumping up and down to pass an ordinance from a guy that goes on trial in June but he may be our only contact.
  15. Optimisticate Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    a) Should be covered in existing laws.
    b) This is how it should be all the time, period. No laws needed for requiring law enforcement to enforce the law and protect citizens.
    c) This should be in effect, look at soup kitchens and what they have to do to pass muster.
    d) Nationwide census coming next year.
  16. Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    bill.gif

    Yes, AO and hopefully other anons live in Riverside County. I doubt you need to be a resident to &quot;sponsor&quot; any idea for new legislation, but it certainly helps.

    I agree that the OP's suggestions aren't quite the ticket, but let's keep brainstorming.

    Also, start raising the $7500 we'll need to contribute to Jeff Stone's campaign fund to get anything passed.
  17. Zak McKracken Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Huh? AO the only anon living in Riverside county?
    Y'all not from around these parts are you?

    Multiple eggs, multiple baskets.
  18. terryeo2 Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    What about proposing an ordinance to give protesters more rights in Riverside County? Ex:

    HARASSMENT AGAINST PICKETERS
    "Any person or persons who knowingly verbally or physically abuse or harass another person while that person is involved in a picket shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and fined a maximum of $1000, or spend 12 months in jail [...].

    Definition of 'harass':

    Any action which causes a picketer distress, including strong language, ad hominum attacks, the use of water systems to cover the picketing route, the use of sound directed towards the picketers that measures above 20.0dB [...]"

    You get the idea. Need someone who knows how to write laws to get it into the right language, but it could be a huge cock-slap against the cult if it passed!
  19. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    knowingly causes endangerment (encroachement on pedestrian walkway, slippery surface, pushed into dangerous traffic with sprinklertech, etc) while exercising first amendment protected rights, etc

    malicious, with intent, etc
  20. terryeo2 Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Yeah, we could write an ordinance on the water issue alone :)
  21. A.Non Hubbard Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    How about an ordinance that if a person is not seen in public for over 30 days and are suspected of being held against their will the cops have to check up on them at their last known location.

    It's obviously not targeting Scientology, because why would happy tone 40 scientologists, part of the most ethical group of people on the planet, be kept against their will at an armed compound?
  22. Smurf Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    It will never happen. 4 of the 5 board members won't for it and even Bob Buster is not going to sacrifice his political career and relationship with his fellow board to do this.

    You have to remember that as supportive Buster has been with our right to freely protest at Gold, his political survival depends on meeting the needs of his constituents, and if he introduces legislation on their behalf, that has to be approved by the Board as a whole, he won't do anything to endanger that with a new controversial ordinance.

    The problem is not the ordinance. It's how the Riverside County Sheriff's Dept is going to enforce it. Anons need to put pressure on Assistant Sheriff Peter Labahn who attended the hearings and provided the RCSD report to the Board (the same one that Catherine Fraser whined about refusing to take her calls or meet with her to discuss the ordinance, i.e., influence the decisions of the RCSD.

    I spoke to Mr. Labahn for a few minutes after the hearing. Nice guy. I didn't get the impression that he likes the Scilions that much, but is job is as much political as it is law-enforcement.
  23. terryeo2 Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Well, there are a few political things you can do in Riverside:

    - try proposing these ordinances
    - try getting the other ordinance revoked, made more clear about Gold Base
    - get the public to un-elect these board members

    Anons are strong where they are handing out leaflets, and talking to the general public on the street. Anons are REALLY strong when they are doing the same kind of thing on the internets. Anons are weak when they are facing corrupt politicians, and in "money talks" situations.

    So...I think this could happen, but we need to use our STRENGTHS to do that. First we figure out a concrete plan of action, be it removing Jeff Stone, from office or passing an ordinance, and we use our excellent skills in flyering, theatrical demonstration, web marketing, etc to get as much support in Hemet as possible.

    ~ 12 Anons vs 4 corrupt politicians? FAIL
    an ENTIRE FUCKING TOWN vs 4 corrupt politicians? WIN
  24. Herro Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    That would be unnecessary. All the issues you're talking about are covered by existing law and the constitutionally protected right to assemble and protest peacefully. If those laws aren't respected and enforced by local authorities, then I see no reason why they would feel compelled to enforce an even lower level law (county ordinance). And I doubt people are going to see sprinklers as infringing upon your rights.

    Again, no point. The problem isn't the lack of a law, the problem is with the enforcement of the law. If someone isn't seen in 30 days and suspected of being held against their will, the police will investigate when it is brought to their attention (missing person's report).

    Do you have proof of corruption? There's a difference between politicians being lazy and refusing to educate themselves and politicians being corrupt.

    Anyways, I think people should also realize that trying to draft new ordinances or repeal existing ones is kind of a waste of time because a) the existing ordinances still leave room for protest, and b) this really is a minor issue in the grand scheme of things. I guess it would be worth while for people who spend a lot of time picketing at gold, but in the long run this really makes little to no difference to chanology. Not saying it should be ignored, just that the effort put in should be proportionate to the importance of the issue. While gold is obviously of the most importance to the scilons, picketing there doesn't really raise much awareness because of it's isolated location.
  25. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    a) Dox Please
    b) The keeping them in protection part is? or not ?
    c)Kitchens yes. Dorms No.
    d) Oh, your right.

    point is not to get these things. To find a way to get government on city and county to act and become greater involved in protecting all people as well as help anyone who may want to escape a cult. The Riverside county council meets with CoS to plan how to "improve" the area why can't we ?

    Any other ideas ?
  26. NotSoAnon Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    At this juncture, the encroachment issue is likely the only handle left to Anon. I think that someone needs to find a couple of surveyor's benchmarks in the Highway 79 route through the cult compound, and start with a GPS, even though not totally accurate, to plot the centerline of the road, mark with paint. Plotting the centerline will require access to surveyor's drawings and data, as well as for finding the benchmarks.

    From my fooling around with Google Earth and the ruler tool (who knows how accurate this is?), the boundary on the west side of Highway 79 appears to be at least 3-4 feet west of the western curbing. The Riverside County Highway Department likely has the requisite surveys.
  27. mrfyde Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    You started off on the topics from this thread and then drifted back to 884 with the sprinkler thing.

    It seems you don't like the idea of creating new laws. I don't really either. But I would like a policy to be advertised by the Sheriff's Dept. that says they will come pick you up if you feel threatened and get you out of a bad situation.

    I agree that laws that are not enforced are only effective for people that can be swayed by the mere fact they exist. And adding more laws just to prove that Law enforcement is not doing their job is not the best option, but others have been tried and failed. The idea of suggesting a law or ordinance is to determine if the council's voting record is consistent. The laws are not made by the suggestion of them. This is suggesting playing a political game. Citizens can suggest all they want. Politicians are judged how they respond to those suggestions.

    How do you suggest proof of corruption if you do not engage the ones who suspected of corruption. You are right there is a difference, but somebody worked HARD to get 884, I would like to know how how hard they would work on something that protects people from the cult as well. If they are lazy they will not fight an effort to pass new ordinances and programs.

    a) that is debatable and unproven because (as bob buster pointed out 884 is lacking in definitions. But this thread is not supposed to be about 884.

    b) I agree that picketing gold should not be our ONLY course of action but if you feel that GOLD is dominating WWP and gives you few other threads to post your comments on you should create more threads and start your own projects to get people involved. Don't shit on some other project just because you don't want, or know how to contribute to it.
  28. Herro Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Valid points. I mentioned sprinklers because someone in this thread said that should be included in assaulting or harassing protesters. The thing about the cops comming to pick you up if you're in a bad situation is already in place. You call the police and say you need help, no law needed. Trying to propose new regulations isn't the most efficient or clear method of testing the political winds of the council. But hey, if you've got the time and energy, go for it. I just wouldn't expect anything more than eye rolling from the council. And finally, just because I'm critiquing what I see as unrealistic strategy doesn't mean I'm shitting all over things. Someone's got to break up the circle jerk. I remember a time when the KISS principle reigned supreme. That was when the most shit got done.
  29. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Herro, don't take this like i'm agreeing with u or anything, but i really liked the idea of trying to get ACLU to monitor next protest/raid.

    Def adds legitimacy to our concerns.
  30. TomVorm Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Reference data is readily available at Riverside County Offices

    Road Data: Surveyor Maps (available at 4080 Lemon St., Riverside CA 92502)

    Riverside County Map 3-E-1 (65-A) (old data, possibly from the 1920's)
    Record of Survey Book 59 Page 37 (early 1970's data, shows local benchmarks)

    Road Data: Deeds (available at 2724 Gateway Drive, Riverside CA 92507)

    Original Grant Deed: Book 544, Page 549 of Deeds (December 15, 1926)

    The road course is also noted in CSI deed copies
    #1989-0303632 (for APN 430-150-001), 19625 address/West Side of Road
    #1989-9922766 (for APN 430-140-008), North Lot
    #1989-9933414 (for APN 430-150-014). East Side of Road
    Another deed is #1988-082334 (not sure which parcel is in that deed)

    Another Source is the Caltrans District Office in San Bernardino.

    If copies of the above were acquired, a surveyor would have a starting point,
    for comparing the legal course of the road (with its present course).
  31. TinyDancer Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    I don't want to dampen the discussion, because it's important to try and push the boundaries in our thinking before we then take the next step of identifying all the hurdles. My thought was it would be a bit tricky to prove that NO ONE has seen the person in public for 30 days. Your idea is to try and require the cops to follow up missing persons reports. How much has this been a problem?

    As far as I can tell, the problem with the CoS is that we either don't know who IS at a certain place, eg Gold, so we can't ask about their well-being, or we know who is missing but not where they are - eg Stephanie Headley
  32. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    You love Herro. You're gonna marry Herro.
  33. Herro Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    We're already fisting one another on a weekly basis.
  34. restim Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Nobody cares about harassment of picketers except the picketers themselves. Replace picketer with pedestrian and you just might be on to something though, and it just might address the problems Smurf identified.

    Protecting pedestrians just might be sufficiently motherhood and apple pie that [strike]cult stooge[/strike] Chairman Stone would oppose the suggestion alone.

    What happened to Pacora? Is she active anywhere here since the meeting? Or is anyone in touch with her? She knows these guys. She would know if this idea stands a chance of success with them.
  35. King Nerd Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Pics?
  36. Herro Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    I'll do you one better. How about Blu-Ray DVD with 7.1 Dolby Surround?
  37. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    I have many pics of me fisting Herro, if you want them.
  38. Anonymous Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    Everytime I fist him, he yells "Elron MOAR!!!"
  39. King Nerd Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    I'm making popcorn as I type this.
  40. mrfyde Member

    Re: How do we get a New New Ordinance in Riverside ?

    The cops picking you up is in place ? I was under the impression that if for example someone's husband was a threat they would go and help you get your things out, or take the husband out of the house.

    Again I would like to see the politician that wants to NOT have that program especially if he and the entire community are aware of EXACTLY who are involved. Communities don't like to have World Cult Headquarters in their neighborhoods.
    Rajneeshpuram - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Unrealistic strategy is a good argument. But I see it as was a win/win if these programs go thru we win and if we raise awareness that the council MIGHT be pandering to the cult we win.

    Keeping it Simple has really worked well for us in the past to raise awareness. It is hard to tell how well it is working even though there are signs it is. It keeps the cult from spreading as far as I can tell. But I think it has worked and continues to to hold the cult at bay but I don't see how it can gain more ground than it already has. (and that is A LOT of ground already gained) I think it is important to keep up what we have been doing for the last year, and we are running out of ideas to gain the last few feet of ground. Ideas in this thread will smoke Scn out of their hiding and force them to show their true colors. And what better place for them to show their true colors other than GOLD.

    All of that being said I am not going to continue to promote the ideas in this thread because they do not seem to have support. Not trying to lay on a guilt trip but don't want to be a leader-fag. It is (as it should be) now in the hands of RS residents. I would do my best to help if others would care to take on similar projects.

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