"I'm not a Scientologist but..."

Discussion in 'News and Current Events' started by Anonymous, Oct 3, 2009.

  1. Anonymous Member

    "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    How many times have we heard this? It seems to be the norm now. Someone comes up at a raid, claims not to be a Scientologist, and then either accuse us of being bigots, or defend Scientology ("IT WORKS AND IT HELPS PEOPLE", "LET THEM BELIEVE WHAT THEY WANT", etc). Why?

    Why would someone deny that they are a Scientologist? It's almost like they're ashamed to admit they are one. A famous example of this is Will Smith. He has hundreds of connections to Scientology, and donates money to them, and then there's the NVLA. And yet, he adamantly denies that he is a Scientologist. Why? Maybe he isn't one, but then why would he use the tech and donate to the cult?

    My question is this. Why do Scientologists deny that they are Scientologists? Are they ashamed, or do they somehow think that by saying they aren't Scientologists, that makes their argument more convincing?
  2. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    I'm gonna go out on a limb and suggest that perhaps they really aren't Scientologists?
  3. CLOCKSHIT Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Is that another Herro post, the mega ................(your choice) of all time?
  4. CLOCKSHIT Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    No LRH told them to lie! Never admit it because your cause is to clear the planet of all fucking SP!
  5. Anonymous Member

    "I'm not a Scientologist Butt"

  6. Legion Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    hail xenu
  7. qwertyuiop1 Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    We kind of see this happening in MV california
  8. Apotheker Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Ask them for xenu and why they don't wanna belief.

  9. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    "Now you say you have to be absolutely truthful. Sincerity is the main thing, and truthfulness is the main thing and don't lie to anybody … and you'll get ahead. Brother you sure will. You'll get ahead right on that cycle of action, right toward zero! It's a trap not being able to prevaricate … This makes life more colorful! "
    -L. Ron Hubbard, Philadelphia Doctorate Course, lecture "How to Talk to Friends about Scientology"

    For Hubbard, the ends justified the means. If telling a "white lie" gets people into Scientology (the "desirable result"), then Scientologists should communicate an "acceptable truth".

    "So PR becomes the technique of Communicating an acceptable truth -- and which will attain the desirable result." HCO Policy Letter of 13 August '70, L. Ron Hubbard "Handling truth is a touchy business ... Tell an acceptable truth." The Missing Ingredient, - L. Ron Hubbard, 13 August '70
  10. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."


  11. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    They're "Astroturfing".

  12. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

  13. the anti Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    in scientology they believe breaking up families, along with harassment of critics is the right thing to do
  14. Herro Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    No, but this is a Herro post.
  15. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

  16. Oswald2001 Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    $cilons sit around in their Hypnotic Mind Control circles doing their Hypnotic Mind Control with ther Hypnotically Mind Controlled yahoo CULT pals and in their Hypnotic Mind Controlled states, they actually believe their own Hypnotic Mind Control BS.

    Exactly like a guy laying in the gutter in Skid Row proclaiming to the world that he is Julius Ceasar or Napolean. He may really believe it, but, no sane person believes it.

    Alternatively, it's like a 15 year old girl trying to sell her parents on getting her birth control pills. "It's just to control my periods. I'm not going to have sex. Don't you trust me!?".

    No one believes it but the $cilons.

    It's a classic case of "Fools fooling fools.".

    Chain chain chain
    Chain chain chain
    Chain chain chain
    Chain of fools
  17. sheep dip Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Attention! Everyone in this thread shut your hole and post more bubble butts.
  18. Hollow Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Why would someone who isn't a muslim defend their faith?
  19. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    I'm not a Muslim nor I have I ever been one, but I've gotten into many arguments with people when they criticize Islam or the Koran based off of a misconception or falsehood.
  20. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Hell, I've even lectured people about what Scientologists believe when someone says something like "Don't those guys worship Xenu or something like that?"
  21. Tenebrous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    There's going to be a fair percentage of the population (both liberal and conservative) that are going to find this to be bigotry. It's pretty much a given when you consider that chanology is protesting, what appears at first glance, to be their faith.

    Anytime you question any aspect of any religion you're going to get that crowd. It doesn't really matter that the person isn't in the religion, they feel that they share a commonality, in that respect. Is it necessarily correct? Fuck no

    That said, while chanology isn't inherently bigoted against scientology's beliefs, there are more than a fair share of bigots on this site. Scientologists could cure cancer and some of you fags would have something bad to say about it.
  22. Legion Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

  23. ARC Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Every person I've come across at raids who were "not a Scientologst" but defended Scientology, turned out to be a Scientologist anyway. I think it's because they know that being a Scientologist weakens their argument, but they don't realize that it doesn't matter if you're a Scientologist or not if your argument is a good one in the first place. The result is that they show themselves to be liars. How sad.

    I appreciate those Scientologists who come out and talk to us and admit that they're Scientologists. I respect that, and those conversations have been interesting.
  24. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    The latter.
  25. Tenebrous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Another thought, if you were talking to a crowd that thought your group was composed of brainwashed imbeciles you might be inclined to state that you weren't a part of that group, for no other reason than to get your statements out before everyone starts rolling their eyes and saying "stupid cultie".

    Not the best approach, imo, but I could see someone trying to trojan horse in their argument in that manner.
  26. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Arn't some of those that try to hide their affiliation to Scientology under instructions or trained not to disclose certain kinds of information like a Manchurian candidate.
    There are scientologists that are more decent about talking about the particulars then others. Is it the training that makes the difference in the behaviors. It sounds like a lot of the over zealous reactions can turn out to be dangerous to all the parties involved.

    In scientology, when is sorry really sorry? A few protesters have in the past been assaulted by scientologists that almost immediately go into some kind of PR mode and start to say things like,' I don't know why I did that,' after the abuse occurs. They continue to hide their affiliations and abuses then attack people for pointing out the truth.

    There seems to be plenty of evidence for concealing the truth by design.
  27. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Given their bait and switch nature - at what point does a Scientologist become a Scientologist?

    Presumably, having a personality test doesn't make you one. Presumably, being talked into buying your first course doesn't make you one (after all, it's compatible with your existing religion, right?)

    So, say you have a bit of auditing, get something off your chest, sign up for a bit more, but still consider yourself a Christian (say), are you a scientologist?

    Might we regard that person as a cultist, but them not see themselves as having bought into it as a religion?

    And so the 'acceptable truths' start to form - the cult might allow someone to honestly believe they aren't a 'scientologist' per se, even as they slide deeper and deeper into the clutches of the cult.

    To the rest of the world of course, they're in the cult, they're 'donating', they're scientologists - they just haven't realised it yet...

    Or maybe that's all crap - might be interesting to hear from some ex's at what point they would call themselves a scientologist without a second thought.
  28. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    If she would just drive that SUV down to skid row, she might be able to get laid.
  29. DeathHamster Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Too bad that's .. a lie. (Surprise!)

    Scientology's Volunteer Ministers Trained to Lie

    CoS's own lawyer has told a court that the people who have received this training can not be trusted to tell the truth in court.

  30. Ogsonofgroo Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Purrrrrrrrrfect, meaowwwww!


    'I am not a scientologist butt......... but I may be an anus.'

    well. sich is life :(

  31. Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    "If I were a scientologist, I'd be ashamed to admit being one in public too!"

  32. Grunce Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    I think this is a major reason behind the described behavior. People who have learned the art of critical thinking know that it is a fallacy to think an argument is answered simply by asserting that the person putting forth the argument is unpleasant (ad hominem) or has too much vested interest* in the matter to be honest (ad hominem circumstantial.) Either the argument is logically valid and founded on correct facts, or it is not; none of these factors are dependent upon or can be determined by study of the person presenting the argument.

    But Scientologists are trained to do the exact opposite:

    - Jon Atack, A Piece Of Blue Sky, Chapter One

    If you're trained to believe (and try and induce other people to believe) that arguments are completely dealt with by attacking the source, then it's only natural that you will try to defend yourself against such attacks you think will come at you. You'll defend yourself in any way you feel you're entitled to defend yourself - and L. Ron Hubbard encouraged Scientologists to feel entitled to do anything when it served Scientology, because "clearing the planet" was such an ethical action it certainly made up for telling "shore stories" to "wogs"...

    Basically, Scientologists want to have it both ways. They want to be seen as informed experts on Scientology. They want to be seen as completely unbiased and trustworthy on the subject of Scientology. But by the standards that they themselves promote, they can't claim to be both at once - they have to claim to be Scientologists to be seen as informed experts on Scientology and they have to claim to not be Scientologists so they won't be vulnerable to the same accusations of bias that they hurl at others.

    * A person's argument may have to be looked at with more of a skeptical eye if they have a significant vested interest, naturally. But that vested interest does not substitute for an actual refutation of the argument itself.
  33. DeathHamster Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    Fail. Straw man argument.

    Scientology has never proven their claims that they do cure cancer.
  34. Anonymous Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    They'd have trouble with skinned knees, heaven forbid anything serious or real.

    They cannot cure their own insanity, expect nothing beyond that.



  35. failboat Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."


    you realize he said "could" and was speaking hypothetically, right?

    he's pointing out that ppl are so turned off by CoS that they've sometimes abandoned using real logic (see Grunce's post ITT for a logic primer) and do hurtful, bigoted things when it strikes their fancy.

    to each his own, but call a spade a spade, too.
  36. Boggle Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    When it serves their purpose, Scientologists will lie about being Scientologists (I'm not a Scientologist, but...") just as they will lie about their many front groups being run and controlled by Scientology.

    Scientology is, covertly, at war with the "wog world," and deception is regarded as the primary tactic of "war."

    Scientologists believe that they are fighting the "war" for the benefit of Mankind and to ensure their own "eternity," since - per Hubbard - if any "thetans" (souls) are to escape the black pit of the "dwindling spiral," ALL must escape it, and the only escape possible is through Scientology and the Scientology Bridge. Therefore, everyone must become a Scientologist or, at least, be under the control of Scientology.

    Scientologists will covertly lie, because they believe it's a matter of "survival!"
  37. DeathHamster Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    I don't think I'm the one who needs a logic primer.

    "If Scientology brought green cheese down from the Moon, balanced the budget and gave everyone really cute puppies, some people would still make fun of them."

    Wake us up when that happens, 'kay?
  38. determu Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    <---- Buddhist

    Scientology spits in the face of Buddhism

    nothing follows
  39. COB Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    ITT, no one likes Scientology :(
  40. WorldOfPeople Member

    Re: "I'm not a Scientologist but..."

    A lot of Scientologists try this thinking that it makes themselves more convincing. They can be ignored.
    However, a small but I believe significant number of these people really aren't Scientologists, but normal people who just don't get what all the fuss is about. I've recently had some interesting discussions with people like that, my favourite quote being, "Geez, I had no idea anybody took Scientology that seriously, even Scientologists. I thought it was a joke religion to get money from celebrities, like Kaballah."
    We need to be careful not to mix these two up, since the latter group are simply deeply misinformed or underinformed about Scientology and once informed tend to be quickly outraged by Scientology.

    They need to know that Anonymous are not religious bigots. We do not infringe on people's right to believe in Xenu and Thetans if they want. People can believe in whatever they like- as long as they do not use it as an excuse to damage or destroy the lives of others. It is the human rights abuses, the illegal and immoral business practices and the downright evil manipulation of people's belief and fear for selfish ends that Anonymous attacks.

    Scientology is not a joke.

    Neither are we.

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