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Is it true you met L. Ron Hubbard?

Discussion in 'Situation Rooms' started by Reversetide, May 7, 2013.

  1. Gottabrain Member






    Do you see what we are all looking at here, reversetidez?

    Your posts maintain the speech pattern of a psychopath.
    http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/mindmelding/201301/what-is-psychopath-0

    If posting on the Internet causes you to become glib, untruthful, insincere, if posting on the Internet causes you to discard others and forget they are human... if posting on the Internet brings about a compulsive persona in you that is not unlike a psychopath, then you should probably find a new activity.

    Have a look. This is how you appear to us, and to any who might happen across your posts.

    If it is not the Internet, but the subject of Scientology or L Ron Hubbard that brings out these terrible characteristics in you - for whatever reason - then you had best stay away from those subjects. For your own good as well as for the good of all well-meaning individuals in contact with you.
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  2. The Internet Member

    The reactions you are getting are in response to your own belittling statements toward people posting on this forum.

    Please continue.

    doorknob.jpg
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  3. Oh? You are diagnosing "psychopathy" in strangers on the internet now are you? Like a free service out of the goodness of your heart? All those years in medical school and all those years working in hospitals and caring for and treating people with serious mental issues and here you are giving your time so freely and generously. You are a saint DGottabrain, I applaud you. This is not the usual labelling others unflattering labels in order to dominate the thread using shame and imaginary baloney, this is Dr. Gottabrain, a trained mental health professional. There is not much I can say. I must be a "psychopath". You would not just lob around a term like that willy nilly.


    :rolleyes:
    reversetidez
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  4. It is odd, to me, you pull out "belittling statements" and how you people buy your own BS. Do you care to take a tally of of comments that fall into your definition of "belittling statements" and who said them in this thread? My comments were for the most part reasonable and considerate and sincere. I retorted to some highly inconsiderate and insulting comments appropriately and with a great deal of restraint. But as is tradition, you have blind spots for anyone wearing your group badge.

    Anywhooooo, I had more to say so I returned and I said it but now I am moving into repeating myself, and that is an unnecessary exercise.
    reversetidez
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  5. OTeleventy Member

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  6. Anonymous Member

    wrong person.jpg
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  7. Anonymous Member

    It could only be masochism that keeps you here amongst people you find so unfair, Reverso.

    And here you are, still, breaking your word in such an undignified manner, as if your word never had any value.

    Commiserations.
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  8. billybob Member

    Disagree on all points.

    1. Reasonable. No, in fact you showed that you cannot be reasoned with.
    2. Considerate. No, in fact the only consideration you have shown is for your own goals. You have ignored others questions, opinions, stories, and observations.
    3. Sincere. Ha! That's a laugh! What were your sincere intentions when you came here?
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  9. Ok, you are 100% right and I am 100% wrong. Case closed. ;)
    reversetidez
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  10. OTeleventy Member

    It only took 9 pages.
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  11. Not necessarily intentional. The swastika is an ancient alchemical symbol that predates the Nazi's by thousands of years.

    The "Star of David" was also adopted by the Jews but it again predates them. It is two triangles, the upward facing one represents the male and the downward - the female. I think its even in the back of the Davinci code book. :)
  12. The Internet Member

    The one point you made that I agree with: it isn't fair to say you might be a sociopath, because what people say on the Internet is only a tiny part of what goes on in their heads.

    I don't agree with the way you repeatedly try to re-frame valid criticism of Scientology as irrational bigotry. Labels are fine when they are accurate.
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  13. CarterUSP Member

    You really haven't been around here very long have you.
    Perhaps you should... *ahem*... lurk moar.
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  14. Asheera Member

    More content to supplement the comedy.

    Phil Spickler talks about a rather amusing incident where he believes that Hubbard did ‘invisibility’ to escape the FDA (about 7 mins in):
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=SZ48lxzhSsw
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  15. The case of reversetidez vs. the protestors is closed but I will reply to this anyway ......"bigotry" is your spin, your labelling to maintain your point of view. You ll rail against your take on what is being said, rarely on what is actually being said, because often what is being said is benign and quiet rational so you add your spin to it to have something worth fighting with.

    And notice my reply to that ridiculous "psychopath" comment by the distinguished mental health professional Dr. Gottabrain was deleted. ;)
    reversetidez
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  16. The Internet Member

    Anyone who can predict what I'm going to post on the Internet must be a very distinguished mental health professional.

    If you are having fun with your trolling that's great. But if you'd like to have an actual conversation, you might try quoting from a post and responding to that quote rather than over-generalizing.
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  17. Nice try. And if you are going to label anyone who does not wear your group badge not promote your point of view as "trolling" so be it. And "bigotry"? But just more convenient framing on your part. Show me where I accused anyone of "bigotry" or where I predicted what you will say? Notice that I was specific with you about your BS use of the word "bigotry" and you just ignored it, so being specific is no guarantee of this "actual conversation" you speak of. Specifics are ignored and conveniently labled nitpicking amoung other things and when specifics start being used then protestors will switch to arguing generalities. On the internet one resorts to whatever approach will maintain dominance of the thread.


    Also nice attempt to rescue your team mate who is casually diagnosing strangers as "psychopaths" on the internet.
    reversetidez
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  18. Asheera Member

    Continually trying to assert that your detractors are merely trying to “maintain your point of view” is comical given that:

    1) You’ve never once addressed the purpose and content of this thread. You started the thread purporting to ask a question, but have pretty much abandoned that from the get-go in favour of wordplay and obfuscation.

    2) Persistent self-victimhooding. Everything and everyone associated with WWP is apparently out to get you in this thread, and it’s the only talking point you have to try derailing this thread.

    Usually trolling has some sort of rationale behind it. Examples include getting people to think, trying to get a reaction, trying to derail, etc. Those really don’t apply here, and your obsessive need to persevere (I MUST BE AT CAUSE) has rendered you a pathetic dishevelled play-thing for the masses.

    It isn’t that you are fighting a losing battle (there isn’t even a war ffs).
    It isn’t the utter transparency and amateurish nature of your tactics (most people ITT know of the internets work).
    It isn’t even the blatancy of the twisting (hidden, and still accessible, suddenly becomes deleted).
    It isn’t even a need to mock people who are either different or of an opposing view. (how can it when none of the content is being discussed by you)

    It is none of these – rather this is a classic case of a troll failing so horribly that they are, in effect, trolling themselves. Your ineptitude and sophistry ITT are simple touch points around which people are generating rope – and all you are doing is hanging yourself for the amusement of others.

    It is fucking hilarious and the gift that, for now, keeps on giving.

    Back to content:

    Another great piece of testimony from two people who knew and worked with Hubbard personally (very long):


    Adelle and Ernie Hartwell weren’t hardcore Scientologists when they worked with Hubbard, and this gives their testimony a different perspective than other ex-members. If you prefer the written word you can access the transcripts of their testimony below (although I do recommend the video, which gives a much better feel for what they are describing):
    http://www.american-buddha.com/cia.testimonyrondewolfclearwater8.htm
    http://www.american-buddha.com/cia.testimonyrondewolfclearwater9.htm

    The couple also submitted affidavits to the commission:
    http://www.american-buddha.com/cia.scientologyclearwater.exhIX.hartwell1.htm
    http://www.american-buddha.com/cia.scientologyclearwater.exhIX.hartwell2.htm

    From Bare Faced Messiah:
    An aside, this thread is the third result in the google machine for the search term “people who knew hubbard”, and the OP as its stands is something I’m more than happy with surfers finding.
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  19. Says you. This whole "situation" is quite "comical".

    Says you. I actually did "address the purpose and content of this thread" more than once. But hey, you did not see it, no problem.

    Says you. What you are saying is not accurate nor representative of what has happened in the thread. You are labelling it in a way that promotes your wishes for this thread, and keep doing that , you will win. That is the daunting impressive power of language.

    Says you. Great imagination you have there Asheera.

    You are some kind of authority with a PhD in "trolling". I can't say much, I do not use that word and have no clue why people do since almost everyone falls into the popular definition of it at one time or another. Given the topic of this thread , you think you have not been "trolling" this thread by posting the off topic posts you have been posting? What a convenient little blind spot you have there.

    You appear, to me at least, to think you are in a war against the evil doers out there trying to steal your pot of gold.

    Lets talk about "tactics" Asheera, do you have or use any or is it just other people?

    You do realize you are talking about yourself right?

    If you say so. Frame it anyway you need to to try and maintain your dominance here.
    reversetidez
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  20. billybob Member

    No, it was not. It is simply hidden because of too many "dislike" votes.

    Also, I don't think that Gottabrain's observations were at all ridiculous.

    Your actions here really do point toward a serious mental disorder.

    You come to this board and use generalities to label all of us as a single-minded group. You use contentious labels such as bigotry, accuse us of being blind, etc. You exhibit passive-aggressive communication, framing yourself as an innocent bystander who has been unfairly ridiculed for asking a simple question. However, we all know you are playing a game.

    Why? We all know this is a game you have no chance of winning. SO why?
    Why continue to reply to this thread? What is your purpose here?
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  21. Thanks re: the "hidden" thing.

    Re: your agreement with Dr. Gottabrain, all that indicates to me is that she wears the same group badge as you. Calling others sociopath or "psychopath" on the internet is teenage schoolyard level speaking. People in thoughtful considerate settings do not lob those words around casually. And if Gottabrain has some special flawless qualifications and authority I am unaware of, then I apologize and will go and seek some treatment and medication and thank her for her unsolicited but generous diagnoses.
    reversetidez
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  22. billybob where and when did I use the word "bigotry" ? I will immediately commit seppuku (ritual suicide) if I did.
    reversetidez
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  23. Same question to you
    reversetidez
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  24. You all know that internet habits die hard and escaping involving internet cults even harder.

    But really done with this counter productive exercise, and will not be replying or lurking this page after this post. I view things like this like playing scrabble or risk and do not take the it as a serious place to champion for people or things, but I know you do. So on that note I will try not to let the door hit me on the way out. :D Good luck labelling the universe more the the Scientologists. Watch out for "psychopaths" that are out to get you with insidious questions like "has anyone here actually met L Ron Hubbard?"
    reversetidez
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  25. billybob Member

    We don't need no stinkin' badges.

    I did not call you anything. Neither did Gottabrain. I merely described your behavior here in this thread.
    You are the one framing this as something more, a "diagnosis."

    We are merely telling you how you come across to people when you communicate the way that you have here in this thread.
    This may be your intention. By behaving in such a way, you are setting up a situation whereby you can cry foul when called out on your passive-aggressive methods.

    Finally, by reducing each individual who responds to you as a member of a group, you are denying each person here their individuality, and thus their humanity.
    You are the one in this thread who is not considerate of others. You appear to be inconsiderate of all the people who have been harmed by the teachings of L Ron Hubbard. Because in this thread you have been given much information to answer your initial query, but you chose instead to engage in semantic games and passive-aggressive tactics.

    Again, I ask, what is your purpose in posting here?
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  26. billybob Member

    So now that we proved that indeed there have been many members of these online critic groups who indeed did know L Ron Hubbard personally, have we completely satisfied your curiosity?
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  27. Asheera Member

    It was started as one of those “gotcha” threads based on the following logic: If you haven’t met Hubbard you cannot criticise him. Just another way to try dismissing critics, although I’m still undecided between whether this a cult troll or an anon troll.

    Leaning more towards a cult troll since most anon trolls would have given up by now and moved on to other things. The logic underpinning starting the thread hasn’t just been dismantled – it’s lead to a lovely gathering of entheta all in one place. The perseverance as a reaction to that suggests cult troll to me.

    Random fact – I have met 3 people in real life who knew Hubbard personally. One is still in, and the other two were more than happy to discuss all of this at length with me.

    More contributions. I typed out the material that was here:
    http://www.wikiscientology.org/archiv/timetrack/dincalcidebrief/dincalcidebrief_page1.shtml

    Page 3 seems to be down – I don’t suppose anyone has a copy of it so I can type it out too?

    DEBRIEF OF JIM DINCALCI ON MY TRIP WITH LRH IN 1973

    This is being written over a year after the trip which started on 4 December and ended for me at 24th Sept 73 one week after LRH arrived back on Flag.

    In the beginning of Dec 72 LRH came up from Tanger because of possible trouble in Maroo and LRH did not want to get the Scientologists there pulled in on it as the trouble was directed at him. So he came up to Lisbon alone. I was contacted when he came up as I was the Flag Medical Officer who had been working with LRH as his MO also. I had been giving him Massages and vitamin program and had been going down to Maroo as courier to give him massages.

    On 4dec in Lisbon LRH was told by John Bragin CS PRAC that he could be extradited to France from Portugal on a court case which was occurring in Paris against the org and LRH. LRH therefore decided to go to the US as opposed to pulling in trouble to the ship which was being refitted and couldn’t go us.

    He was planning on going with just Paul Preston who was acting as steward and body guard. (Paul had been a green Beret in the US army as a seargent and then in the special forces.)

    I asked LRH if I could go also as a second on the trip there going independently not in contact with he or Paul in case there was trouble I would be able to communicate this out to get it handled right away.

    LRH okayed this so we left that morning early for the airport. Me staying away from the group. After some plane delay we got off to New York and arrived. LRH had trouble in customs as he was carrying $100,000.00 cash which had to be declared. From there we went together to the City after passing through customs.

    In New York city we ate, I got a different hotel that LRH and Paul. It was decided I would be staying with them until LRH went back to the ship. I went and bought Clothes for LRH and myself so that his mock up could be changed. The hotels were checked into with different names, from there on out our real names were not used so that attention would not be drawn to LRH.

    The next day we moved to a very nice Aptment building in ???? an outlaying part of the city called Queens called the Executive. It had a nice view, close to subway and had Pool heated.

    LRH showed me how to cook and I did the cooking from there on out. When I started doing logistics paul started doing the breakfasts and salads for lunch. I always did the suppers as we were all together when it would be supper time which would be between 2000 to 24000 normally. I did all the food shopping. Paul did the dishwashing and clean up. We all ate together.

    When we firs arrived I got the vitamins that I could make up the formula LRH had mocked up in Maroo which was working. I used a pharmacy I had contacted on my annual leave 3 months before which helped me get things. I mocked up some lettere head of the Apollo so that the guy could have something official for his books, then he could sell me anything as it was going out of the country. This way I got Vit K that was needed and the The Vitamins need and the places I got them from are with CO MU in a write up I did before we left the US to MSH so that all the stuff would be available when LRH got back.

    When we were in the Executive Dec and Jan I started communicating.

    In December I had done a lot of research into the extradition laws of the US, Portugal, Mexico and France. From the US laws I had decided that it was not possible to extradite LRH as a US citizen from the US to a country he had never been in and really had no crime. I also checked the international law and courts and UN library. All of this was xeroxed and with NY shipment. With this find LRH was very happy. Then Bob Thomas who we were in comm with said that LRH could be extradited, which was not true but threw trouble into the scene. It was at this point I put all out security material into 2 safedeposit boxes I had gotten in the wall street area. Into this had gone the money and LRH’s meter I had gotten from the NY org the we had arrived in NY, at the GO office. Plus research into laws. Both of these boxes were gotten with two different false names and addresses from out of town. No ID was requested because “my wallet had been stolen”.

    Whenever we went anywhere paul and I would cut our path if we felt it was necessary to prevent anyone from following us. Like going to different subways and crossing to uptown then downtown trains etc. One very effective method is to wait until the doors are just closing then hold them open and go out. In that way you can also see who would be following you by seeing who else came out then too.

    Paul acted as LRH’s steward and also handled the comm as picking it up and sending. We had telex traffic and mail comm. Telex was sent and received by phone, in code. We used a code adapted from a dictionary. Paul would go out of NY and make the phone calls to LA and receive the answers on a tape recorder. Then cut back and we would decode them. The mail was received at an answering service in NJ, where paul picked it up as a traveling saleman or surveyor.

    I looked for areas to live in that were safe, quiet and easily accessable but with people around. The codwise place apt. fit that categrory. Some Cubans owned it and lives down stairs, they were very upstat. The area was a middle class area to that attention wouldn’t be pulled to us. It was assumed by the neighbours that LRH was our uncle or father. PRAC was good.

    At this place I was able to get a library card with my false name from the Queens library system and with that was able to get a NYC library card which enabled me to check out any books in the whole NY system. In that way I got a lot of books to give LRH to research into.

    It is from this period of early to mid 73 that LRH came up with the Volunteer Ministers program, Psych dictionary, philosophy dictionary, Program Snow White, Photo checksheet (subject control. Also Scientology the state of today (or something like that title was written. This was a HCOB..I did quite a lot of nutrition research. Dictionaries on herbs I got, plus books on them, I especially put a lot of time into trace minerals. I checked out libraries on all the data I could find on it, especially on the hypothalamus, pituitary and other glands. The ida on Trace minerals LRH said was that this is the way the thetan runs the body, they are the controlers of the vitamins. One organ is controlled by a mineral. The minerals travel thru the system. And would activate other minerals in other organs. In this way if the organ is depleted of the proper mineral it will continue pumping out as it hasn’t received the feed back from that other organ if that other organs mineral are depleted this the organ continues pumping and the system becomes exhausted.
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  28. billybob Member

    Interesting section here on how Hubbtard came up with some of his quackery.
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  29. CarterUSP Member

    Says a lot of us actually. Try reading a few posts from time to time instead of assuming what you think the posts say.
    You'll be back.
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  30. Anonymous Member

  31. Ah, group agreement, what you call "reality.":p

    This is how bigots like you and your onlne cult groupthink buddies visciously attack reasonable, sincere and considerate people like myself for asking a harmless question. :confused:

    Whose to say that what is "back" to you may not be a "front" to others. :eek:
    I have other stats to boost, er, i mean, I'm not a Scientologist, but... I have other, more important stuff to do, so once again I will leave you all to your self brainwashing activities!;)
    Reversidz
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  32. Gottabrain Member

    That is not what I said. Your twisting of my word is, again, another example.
    In the post quoted below, I said:
    and gave examples of your posts to show this against a psychology article description on the speech of psychopaths.

    I also said, in the same post:
    and:
    Some people behave badly when posting on the Internet. Postings do not reflect the entire person. You may or may not be a psychopath, but you are the one who stated you forget others are human when you post - and it shows.

    Some on the thread have pointed out your use of Scientology cult words and speech in some of your posts. Since Hubbard taught his followers to abuse anyone who might criticise Scientology using lying or any other means possible, it would be consistent with your speech and behaviour here to assume you are a Scientologist.

    Without meaning to do so, you've provided an excellent personal example of why Scientology is a destructive cult and the hate-speak its followers display to unbelievers. I get a kick out of that. :D
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  33. Anonymous Member

    Iknew an old time - 1950s - Scientologist who believed that Hubbard could change his size at will, and was, at times - apparently only when no one was around with a camera - over seven feet tall with giant hands.

    The same person, now deceased - so I won't mention his name, but incidentally he knew Phil Spickler - also believed that Hubbard was able to levitate his body, and, instead of walking across a room, glide, a few inches off the ground. The reason given for Hubbard walking in front of people, rather than gliding-levitating, was that, if he levitated, Hubbard would have overwhelmed people and, then, those people would not, eventually, through application of Scientology, be capable of similar OT abilities, having been overwhelmed.

    Plus, this same person believed that Hubbard did not want to be worshiped, and deliberately made himself appear less than perfect to prevent people from worshipping him.
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  34. Anonymous Member

    http://www.exscientologykids.com/eskforums/viewtopic.php?t=3332

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_relativism

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth#Major_theories_of_truth
  35. I never met the late Dr. Hubbard; but had I, I would have subjected him to R2-45, just to see if Scientology really worked.
  36. Anonymous Member

    Well, his oldest son knew him very well, and he have a number of interviews.

    Ron Jr. said his father was a hypnotist, who used drugs, drank heavily, and sought power over others.
    • Like Like x 1
  37. Anonymous Member

    He have....

    http://www.rickross.com/reference/scientology/scien240.html
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  38. Anonymous Member

    I've tried this. It works.

    Also, gliding a few inches above the ground can be achieved with roller skates.
    • Like Like x 4
  39. Anonymous Member

    Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can make me think I deserved it.
    • Like Like x 2
  40. Anonymous Member

    ^^^ Victim Tech™. The learned and wonderful Veda from ESMB explains:

    TL/DR: Watch out for Scientologists attempting to play the HE&R game.
    • Like Like x 3

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