Discussion in 'Independent Scientology' started by BodyThetanKilla, Mar 28, 2011.
Fagbook is being an asspie to Jesse. Just sayin'.
His post was good but he continuously loses focus and rambles a bit. I hope he gets a ghost writer if he wants to write a book.
I didn't see the point of his argument about Marty's poor "credentials". IMO Marty's involvement, from what I've read, give enough credibility to his claims about DM (and ONLY his claims about DM....the rest is 100% bullshit). Jesse's arguments against the official credentials make him look like he's still sipping at the Kool-Aid and bawwwing that Rathbun wasn't high enough in the pyramid to make any claims. If that wasn't his aim, he might want to reword his post because that part made me question his intentions.
This one caught my eye:
I think Mr. Prince should spill what he knows here. He's just as bad if he doesn't.
It seemed to me that Jesse was pointing out the "Rank" Marty held, since (in case you may have had a look at his blog and leadership of his Indie movement, Marty constantly makes the point basically that the "Tech" is pure, and Marty knows how to transform and regenerate the mythical promised glories promised by LRH, but which was spoiled and reversed by DM, as supposedly, DM does "Black Dianetics".
What I read into it is Jesse making the observation that it was, in fact, Marty Rathbun himself who was the main player of said "Black Dianetics". Thus, he is full of bullshit as far as wanting to market himself as an expert on the Ethical Implementation of Tech... (translation to normal english = morality) as Marty is a real life criminal. This is a huge point to be made.
and of course, we know that is obvious, but it carries a different weight when it is said by another former Scientologist.
Jesse seems to be saying....
$cientology 2.0 is bullshit.
because the tech is rotten to the core.
Oh...true. Sorry about that Orson,I should had added it on my post.
And wise owl is wise and likes where this thread is going.
Just asking...what is exactly this "Black Dianetics everyone talks about?
Do I really have to lurk moar?
Jesse has written a few affidavits that spill quite a few beans, if you look for those. It looks like he's in the writing mood, so more to come
I think what Jesse met about credentials is that Jesse has credentials of being an expert in the "tech" and Marty doesn't. Marty's expertise was dealing with the wog world and troublesome Scientologists. And if that's the case, why is Marty trying to now pass himself off as an expert in the "tech"?
Click for the answer:
Narcissistic Personality Disorder
I'll try to answer this, COREarg. Supposedly the premise is that Scientology as it is packaged to the outside world, and to those who then get ensnared in its web is that the "tech" (fake psychotherapy) is supposed to help an individual to better their life in every way imaginable, and basically promises to enable a person to make all of their dreams come true.... Feeling better, having healthy communication and thus relationships with others, bring world peace and help mankind. In the "tech" -$cientology practices with the individual sitting with an e-meter and being audited in session, they have an individual go into the depths of exploring their psyche. Now, if we were to look at modern Psychotherapy as being a healthy model, there are very distinct healthy boundaries which create a safe environment where a person is encouraged to talk and share, and gain some insight and move forward.
In $cientology as it is like a combination of renegade, twisted hypnotic "therapy" and the usage of a person's "Sins" - the religious aspect -
to blackmail them into submission and servitude, and there is a great deal of Thought Reform that occurs.
So, if one were to theorize that there might be positive aspects to some form of a therapeutic session, wherein an individual gains a greater sense of self, "Black Dianetics" (and this is both an actual word and also a practice) would do the exact opposite.
"Black Dianetics: would basically incapacitate an individual, ruining their whole life.
And, people who are or were in the cult have a hard time seeing that Dianetics is rotten to the core, and that it is all, in fact, "Black Dianetics". They cannot handle seeing that their hero, LRH was a huge, evil conman and that the whole thing is a sham.
M&M want to think that they can make things better by using the same methods, and that is where Jesse differs.
Of course, you could always lurk moar.
Link regarding "Black Dianetics". Defined and Explained.
Black Dianetics is basically harassment and intimidation.
Here's a link from FACTnet featuring Jesse Prince discussing these matters extensively.
It's a "Religion" teaching its parishoners how to lie to and bully one another.
(contrast that with what you may know as being a good attribute of another major world religion...like the concepts of love and forgiveness)
Looks like they are discussing this over at ESMB : http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=22058
As a WOG, I don't care if Marty is an expert on the "tech" or not. If Marty was only skilled at cleaning DMs toilets (which is probably not far from the truth) but was a witness to many events that we rally against, then he is qualified to tell his story (he takes 'telling his story' to a new level of bullshit, though). I do see the point where his claiming to have "qualifications" plays into his narcissism, thereby he is furthering the cult's abusive policies by proxy. I get that.....but Jessie needs to really get someone to help him state it in a concise manner. He can be a bit confusing to those of us with no time to read through 30,000 words.
Oh, and Jeff......I don't ever recall reading anything from Jesse that mentioned murder in relation to DM so if you have seen it online anywhere, please post the link. The term murder means the taking of another human being's life with malice aforethought, so if Jesse is talking about Lisa McPherson I'm not so sure that DM qualifies as a murderer in that situation.
If DM actually murdered someone, the knowledge of this must be given to the authorities immediately or Jesse will be in a lot of trouble if he is withholding information.
And one step further: Why is he leading an independent movement when completely unqualified (per Jesse) to do so w/r/t the "tech"?
And CoC; lurk moar and word clear conspiracy.
Conspiracy to murder is a totally different crime than murder, and murder requires 'aforethought', which may not have happened unless the conspirators all got together and discussed how they could kill her.
Not saying anyone was murdered here. Wasn't clear enough. In most states, if one is involved in a conspiracy or other criminal act resulting in murder, those involved will likely be charged with murder, not just the guy who pulled the trigger.
It also involves "reverse processing", which is an attempt to cause you to have new engrams. For example, I was in a posting match with a handler in the comments of the Jett Travolta story, who then posted that if I continued to post about it, I would "never feel at ease again". All in all, a pretty transparent attempt to get in my head and create a somatic condition tripwired to my continuing entheta posting.
So Jesse was back for a while, he posted on the M's blog for a time. I thought Jesse was friend w/ the M & M's. No?
That's exactly the point I was trying to make. Jesse should be a bit more concise and clear if he's going to open up about what he knows. He alluded that Marty and Mike would go to prison for "murder(s)" if they revealed their acts to the authorities. That's a pretty strong statement to make without any additional information.
I believe it.
To put it into "normal language", it might be said that it, the "reverse processing" to which you refer could be inducing Trauma =(new engrams).
And, that Trauma goes to a deeper scale, because it is also attached to all of the heavy burdens of guilt and questions about ones potential place in eternity, or Karma.
See, that is the problem inherent in a system like this, run by terribly unhealthy people....they traumatize and berate each other, and it is sick.
There is really little self-responsibility or awareness, as what would be a healthy conscience has been re wired with Ron's dogmatic insanity.
In short, (just my impression as an observer) ..Jesse wanted to be on amicable terms and demonstrate good will. That he did.
When he observed that they are just running the same show, he apparently decided to take a stand and voice his opinion that he clearly does not consent to their activities and general dishonesty at present.
(again, just speaking for myself, from what it looks like to me....not speaking for Jesse)
Can we get Jeff Hawkins give Jesse a hand, in case he hasn't stepped up. Hawkins is pretty adept at running his blog, and it would be nice to see Jesse get some support.
Awww man.... that's terrible. With all this superior and ethical training they still find a way to use their powers for Evil?
Are you still restimulated over it?
Have you tried FZ auditing, to get those little buggers out?
I dunno anymore, it seems that Jesse is running a separate show as well.
I may be wrong, but I may be right.
Naw, I like Philip K. Dick way better than LRH, and I use cannabis as prophylaxis against The Tech...
This is his blogspot profile pic, I think he has seen the image, lmao.
View attachment 208055_189710121073475_100001034664846_564372_3011
Here is one example of Black Dianetics as taught by Hubbard himself.
It's pretty dangerous, and normally I wouldn't post this, but you asked for it.
Poor little clams! Snap! Snap! Snap!
That is so awesome. LMAO!
I think you will find this most interesting in the context:
(considering putting it in an own thread)
This is a good observation but your conclusion is wrong. There are people here better able to discuss this (hi, Pooks) but, in short, there are basically "two techs" in Scientology. You might have heard of the L Ron Hubbard Law of Commotion: for every piece of tech there is an equal and opposite piece of tech. This stems from the fact that, although somewhat similar in some ways, the Red-On-White tech is actually fundamentally different from the Green-On-White tech. The Green-On-White tech is the administrative tech and where you will find the harshest, most brutal aspects of the LRH mind-fuck detailed. The Red-On-White tech is the touchy-feely, healing auditors' tech where you find all the crap like the Auditors' Code and so on. Marty is a Green-On-White specialist and, because of his wet work on behalf of DM, was an expert at running reverse Green-On-White processes.
As I understand it, Jesse's point was that Marty specialised in the administrative tech, not the auditing tech, and, not only that, only really got to use the reverse side of it for most of the time he was in. Now, Marty is out in the wild trying to give the impression that he is an auditing tech guru but, actually, he's doing fuck knows what to people's minds. Jesse's comment is a massive insult from one Scientologist to another and a warning to those who might consider going to Marty's implant station - what's it called again, Cashinthebanka, or something ; )
Also, there's no need to fear the so called "black dianetics". So long as you know you are dealing with a Scientologist, none of the tech works on wogs because we haven't been softened up with years of ethics handlings and hypnotic-like trance states designed to get the tech in. Scientolotgists love to frighten the children with tales of how dangerous their tech is and how it can drive a person nuts - all bollocks. Any actions using "reverse tech" is pre-planned, highly manipulative, and can fuck you up, but no more than the actions of any sociopath. Half its power is that people are frightened of it. The Scientology scripture we all need to be vigilant about is the OSA Network Orders. That's Mike Rinder's speciality. Keep your wits about you, know who you are dealing with, and show no fear. Knowledge is power.
Marty was assigned to be Tom Cruise's auditor, because he is an expert in the tech.
Looks like Marty can't stand the scrutiny...posting 'feel good' crap again for the 'Oh look, something shiny' crowd. Scientology must give you the attention span of a clam!
An expert in "recovery" tech - getting doubters back into the mind-fuck by running reverse procedures to implant new and/or additional "engrams" that, of course, only Scientology can help with. That's Marty's speciality. Well, that plus collecting PC folders for special ops.
Heh!! That's two in a row now. Business must be dropping off - as the hooker said to the leper.
Thanks for the explanation, BLiP. I see the point behind Jesse's statement now, and it is obvious that the intended target was one that understood completely what was written. Post #66 from anon0004 above has a clip where Jesse is pleading to Anonymous that Marty needs more time, that he is still deep in the mind fuck. Do you think he's changed his opinion now?
I was trying to follow the logic of his statement but it seemed all over the place, and I was making the general assumption that Jesse thinks the 'Tech' is all bullshit. WOG justice depends on the opinions of your peers when presented with evidence and it is clear now that he was going after the opinions of Scilons using the 'Tech'. Got it now. Jesus, this is better than any televised legal drama.
^ LAW AND ORDER : WOG JUSTICE
Thanks for the deliver, Anons and Zak. Now I know more. <3
Oh you...! lmao
Believing that we evolved from Clams is not "Black Dianetics".
Believing that the Clam Engram can seriously hurt people is not "Black Dianetics".
but using the Clam Engram, maliciously and deliberately, to hurt people - that would be "Black Dianetics"
If Ron really wanted to use Dianetics to help people and not to hurt them,
he wouldn't have unleashed this terrible Engram on his disciples, or encouraged them to use it on others.
That's just wrong.
So says Marty.
What did he actually audit Tom Cruise on? Was the end result to make him more compliant?
At the March 29, 2011 meeting of the Riverside County Board of Supervisors, AnonOrange mentioned incidents of violence by Marty Rathbun, Jesse Prince, and Rex Fowler and again described how the Lucifer effect applies to Scientology:
Scientology: March 29, 2011 Marty Rathbun, Jesse Prince, and the Lucifer Effect
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