Mike Rinder on Tommy Davis: Pot Calling the Kettle Black

Discussion in 'Independent Scientology' started by Anonymous, Jul 3, 2013.

  1. Anonymous Member

    Open wide . . . I'll spoon feed you. The information fed in by the M&M Show personalised, and thus narrowed, the wider Scientology debate down to "get Miscavige". Missing from the debate at that time, and largely since, is the fact that any and all violence - and all other abuses - within Scientology has been going on since its inception. David Miscavige, for example, received written instructions from the Hubturd to "spit in the face" of John Aczel and David Mayo, and there never has been a single engram. The confusion arises in that it now appears to the largely unread that Scientology, thanks to David Miscavige, is a religion which has gone off the rails and all the abuses can be sheeted home to that single individuality. Not so. The Truth Rundown was when a concerted effort was made to insert that confusion into the debate and portray it as the actions of intelligent people able to "differentiate" Scientology from the "radical" CoS, yadda yadda yadda. A concerted effort led by the former IG Ethics and international PR spokeshole.

    The counter argument to my position is that the M&M Show are not talking to the general public but, instead, are seeking to communicate directly with Scientologists in the cult. M&M Show apologists suggest, and I concede they have something of a point, that telling cult Scilons its all down to the Hubturd is "too steep a gradient" for their "reality level". However, that idea, while with some basis, is itself a "handling" for the well read, yet has seeped out into the public consciouness and is being reinforced by Independents on blogs every day. Rahtbun is continuing to insert confusion into the debate with his latest book in which, for example, he tells his readers the GO was entirely down to Mary Sue and propagates all manner of long-debunked "acceptable truths". Whatever currency Rahtbun's word has stems from the false idea that he was involved in "getting the snowball rolling" and - look - he's admitted something he cannot be charged with. Woopdeefuckingdoo.

    Personally, I would love for the M&M Show to come clean about all the crimes they have knowledge of but I will settle for them both telling the truth about Scientology instead of adding confusion to the debate.
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  2. That is not true, Rathbun admitted but not as taking responsibility, but saying that someone else “made him do it”, just like in the Nuremberg trials. Totally different that saying "oops! I fucked up, I beat people and that was totally uncool - PERIOD"

    Same shit with Rinder, their "admissions" are nothing but a blame-shift to someone else. That is not responsibility or admission of anything.
  3. Random guy Member

    Interesting, I haven't heard that one before. Any sauce for this? It could come in handy!

    Are you saying Tom DeVocht, Amy Scobee, and later all other who have come forward collaborating the original story are part of a mass conspiracy to shift blame from old Dead Liver-Lipps to Miscavige? From all accounts I have heard or read, David Miscavige instigated the culture of physical beating. Granted, old Hubbard was an evil fuck, but he appear not to have been interested in personal acts of violence, rather taking his pleasures in mind control and degradation (the boy in the chain locker springs to mind, as far as I know Hubbard never personally laid his hand on the boy, he had other do that for him).

    Personally I have great difficulty believing all those people acting in unison and remaining in unison. Sooner or later one is going to wake up and spill the beans. Even outsiders like John Atack (who really should know) claims things went from bad to worse under Miscavige.

    Could be. I'm more interested in CoS' public image. Even if the story is Miscavige made it all go to Hades, it will still be an organisation gone to tatters and people will not join. Mission accomplished.

    Also, I'm not all that afraid scientology will survive. We just saw the more radical KSW-group splinter (again). Without the mother cult telling them what to think, the scam will never work. This post by JustBill makes the point much better than I can:

    So you say he fooled two seasoned reporters on scientology (Tobin and Childs) into making him the centrepiece of their story so that he could forward his new Cult II, without them catching on? I find that ... hard to believe.

    Either would be good to mee, but the problem here is these two are (or at least were) true believers. They believe that scientology is good, and will not budge (just like any Christfag or Jewfag will not change their view just because you point out the plot is really, really thin). Only time will tell if they can free themselves of their mental shackles.
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  4. Anonymous Member

    Conspiracy is your dub in word.

    Lurk moar. This is a man who tortured his wife and kidnapped his own baby.

    Its difficult to know whether things have become worse under Miscavige or just more apparent thanks to the interwebz. The point is, nothing David Miscavige has done is outside of the Hubturd's policy and/or own personal example. The idea that getting rid of David Miscavige will make the abuses go away or allow for "reform" is a distraction from the fact that the abuses are endemic to Scientology and David Miscavige can be replaced tomorrow without anything actually changing.

    No. Mission FAIL. Scientology recovered from the Operation Snow White fall out by sacrificing a few executives, keeping the Hubturd beyond the reach of the law and gaining religious charity status. It could easily roll-out the same recovery strategy.

    I agree with Bill, but you will note his premise is that Scientology cannot survive without the cult infrastructure. Until that is gone, its proceeds distributed and billion-plus dollars of assets sold to compensate victims, its criminals brought to justice, its secrets shouted to the four winds, and the ground beneath it salted, Scientology will continue to be the menace that it is.

    No, that's not what I'm saying.

    And here you help Scientology with its religious cloaking . . . sssup with that? I don't give a fuck whether the M&M Show free themselves of their mental shackles, I just want them to start telling the truth, instead of continuing to inject confusion into the debate.
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