Morons on A.R.S

Anonymous · Feb 23, 2008

Morons on A.R.S

I am the person he is responding to

Here's the OP I responded to, the response following contains my response plus the readers response. You don't need to read all of the first post, just get the gist.

Have you ever looked around you while walking around Los Angeles? Do you
ever notice other kids your age, driving cars, shopping for clothes,
enjoying a meal on a restaurant patio?

Some of them are devoted to saving the world, and dedicate some of their
time to saving the environment, being politically active, adopting
causes. But children, these kids aren't spending 99% of their time
running on the Hamster Wheel to Toadle Freedom!

Youth is a time of discovery. Parties with friends, a day at the beach,
your first car, dating, and learning what the real world is all about.

Have you ever been to the mountains or the desert? Or, is your time
spent within the Scientology reality bubble?

So much of what Scientology is teaching you is not true. If you're
reading this, it's possible that you, yourself have nagging doubts, but
you keep them to yourself, don't you? Because you know what will happen
if you dare to share them with a confidant...kr reports, Ethics, the RPF.

Kids, out in the real world, we have the right to speak out about things
we feel aren't "right." Real communication means sharing your thoughts
with others, and getting their input. I have met many ex-Scientologists.
They are, like you, often intelligent people who misplaced their trust.
One thing I think is interesting is, they all harbored these doubts. So,
if there are things about the Sea Org that bother you, be assured that
the people around you are also harboring doubts about Scientology, yet
none of you dare to mention them for fear of reprisal.

This isn't freedom! The gate to the Auschwitz concentration camp had a
message to the prisoners on it; 'Arbeit macht frei,' work makes you
free. The Nazis twisted these words around, being in a concentration
camp doing slave labor isn't freedom!

You are at a time in your life when you should be getting your first car
and exploring the world around you. Like the song says, 'Nobody walks in
L.A."

You should be playing at the beach. You should have your first job, and
be earning your own money for toys like Ipods, computers, video games.
You should have a dog. You should have real friends, who like you for
who you are, friendship not dependant upon membership in a group.

Saving the world is a noble endeavor. But Scientology is a mock-up; the
organization isn't really working in that direction. Deep down inside,
you probably know this, but you don't want to know. Your youth is being
stolen. Many members, when they finally leave, are in their 20s and 30s.
You can never get the time back when you are free to explore the world.
You'll be spit out as an adult into the real world, with no skills, no
connections, no friends. It's harder as you get older.

Right now, there's still time to go to school and learn to do something
you enjoy. Making money is only part of life, but it does grease the
wheels. If you start now, you can take your life back, and still get in
on some of the youthful fun you're entitled to enjoy.

I know, you wouldn't know what to do if you packed up your small
belongings and walked out, never to return. You don't know where to go,
or who to trust. Los Angeles is a big city.

However, there is a big network of people who would be happy to help
you! Magoo, myself, Arnie, Warrior, Dr. Dave Touretzky, we can all be
contacted thru email.

If you're fed up with your life in the Sea Org and Scientology, you can
find help. Some of you, like Magoo, have invested their whole lives
inside Scientology, and you know that, if you leave, you will lose all
your friends and, some of you, your families as well.

That's no different than a drug addict who decides to clean up. They
have to give up their old friends and their old life, too. But, people
do it all the time. It's not impossible.

And here's a funny thing. Ex-members are connecting up with some of
their old, dear friends on the other side of the veil! Sometimes you
just have to wait until they "wake up" too, and leave the organization.

If you stay in, Scientology will use you up. There is no retirement home
for elderly Scientologists. There is no pension plan. When you quit
producing, that's it! You will find yourself on a street corner,
clutching a garbage bag of possessions, with nowhere to go, no Social
Security (such as it is) and few options. You know this is true! An old
person with few skills is doomed to taking crappy jobs for minimum wage,
living in a crappy little apartment somewhere. But, think about it.
They've got their own place, which they don't have to share. Nobody is
going to drink the last milk in their fridge, or eat the last Ho-Ho out
of the cupboard. They can have a television if they wish. They can call
their friends whenever they want. They don't need permission to go out
of town.

It's better when you're young enough to create a decent life for
yourself. Think about it! If you want to cut class, you can, although a
responsible person would realize that they're going to school for a
reason. Having your own car means you can take a drive up Mt. Wilson to
see the snow whenever you want. You don't need anyone's permission to do
anything. That's Total Freedom, kids! Being responsible enough to pilot
your own life, not relying on somebody else telling you what to do,
being free enough to hit the beach on a sunny day when you feel like it.

Taking up hang gliding, riding motorcycles, exploring the boundaries of
your own ability. You should, at this point in your life, be driving
your own bus. Don't you want to?

Surf's up! The fish are biting! The sun is out (well, not today) and you
should be outside, expanding your mind, learning new things, meeting new
friends. You should be driving your own bus. Don't you want to?

One other thing. There are people on this newsgroup whose job it is to
confuse and instill mistrust. They pose as critics of Scientology, but
it's just a Scientology op. All the off-topic posts about eevil psychs,
same thing, a Scientology op to disrupt communication here.

Odd behavior for a group that claims to be committed to communicating,
isn't it?

Road Runner, Truth Seeker, Lily Fired, Space Traveler (aka Roadrunner)
Barbara Schwarz, are all Scientologists trying to break the flow of
communication about Scientology and its abuses. Some pose as critics.
However, they will never recommend critical websites, trying to convince
you that the critical sites are somehow Scientology related OSA ops.

Truth Seeker is known for referring readers to a series of essays,
written by OSA, which purport to be critical.

http://www.xenu.net is one site he won't recommend.
http://www.lermanet.com is another.
The creator of lermanet.com is Arnie Lerma, ex-SO member, who almost
married one of Hubbard's daughters! You can trust him. He has helped
many people get their lives back.

Beware of the sock puppets who say everyone here is OSA. I'm not. On my
hate pages at religiousfreedomwatch.com/extremists, the first thing on
that page is, "Barbara Graham has never been a Scientologist, never had
relatives who were in, etc."

Look at those pages. If a person is listed as a "religious extremist,"
it means they are on Scientology's "enemies list."

Did you ever wonder why a "church" has an enemy's list?
----------------------------------------------
And now, an added note from someone who has been where you are now:
"Rockyslammer's" message to you;

I came into scientology when I was 17 years old - I left when I was 35
years old. I had to start my life anew. I had to work extra hard to
make up for 18 years of not earning. Everything people normally do
much younger. I vowed to give my kids a better start than I made for
myself.

My daughter was born into scientology. We left when she was quite
young. She did her schooling and then went to university. She studied

sound and TV production and has just graduated. She is working her
first job. She is a female DJ and obviously heavily into music. She
teaches kids to DJ. She has travelled to many countries and has just
learnt to surf. She has been riding horses since she was 6 years old
and has had three horses/ponies. At the moment she is learning
dressage. She has boyfriends, a car, a flat of her own and she can
talk to ANYONE she wants. And she does - because she is very outgoing.

She is better at communication than me - an OT! I love her to bits as
I do her younger brother. I am a very proud dad!!

My son is nine and he has great fun playing "Crazy Frog" on a his
little guitar. He is really very good. What is even more amazing is
that he is really hooked on Beathoven's "Flur Elise" - gosh what is the
modern generation coming to? He also loves to boogy board and snorkel.
His school is right on the beach and he swims every day in summer.
Unfortunately he is also addicted to his computer games. Damn!

You know something kids? My two think they have a very "normal" life -
and they do!! Can you get your head around that?

Sea Org kids - what you have isn't life. Read Barbz message again -
think about it.

You are told scientology will deliver something to you - it won't. As
I said I
came in mid 1960's as a 17 year old boy. Scientology does NOT give
what it promises - I promise you. The rest of the world thinks
scientologist are aggressive looneys. They are - but it doesn't have
to be that way for you. Good luck.

Email me if you want to swear at me or ask a question. I can talk to
anyone and if you have the courage so can you.
rockyslam...@postmaster.co.uk

Let's have an addition to my little input.

It was my sons birthday last week - he was 10. What happened that was
special for his birthday celebration? Well he got a $500 guitar - he is
so good that he played recently in front of his entire school. Then we
went to "Snow Planet" where he spent a few hours skiing and snow
boarding. I'm afraid he got a cold wet bum! Then of course there were
the computer games, leggo and hot wheels toys. He is having a party
this week as well.

What happens to you, kids, on your birthday? My son thinks he is just
an ordinary kid - and he is. To me, of course, he is more than ordinary.

The person responding was not the OP. The OP was barb, to avoid confusion.

Anonymous wrote:
> > > We aren't here to sway them from their religion,

Are we not? So I take it you've formulated Standard Strategy(TM) then?

>we're here to correct
> > > an administration.

Are 'we'? When did 'we' decide that? Did I miss a meeting?

>Should they, along the way, lose faith in their
> > > religion then we are accepting in helping people get out.

What does "we are accepting in helping people out" mean?

And who is this 'we'? What group do YOU represent, Matt?

Anonymous wrote:
> Trying to sway people from their religion by speech is nothing new and
> has never worked.

That's what OSA would like us to think. Two salient points:

1. Scientology is not a religion. ("Scientology... is not a religion"
LRH, Creation of Human Ability). Religions don't try to 'destroy'
people. Religions aren't in it to 'Make money, make more money, make
others produce so as to make money." (LRH)

2. Speech is a fantastically effective tool for breaking the cultic
mindset. How do I know this? Look at the incredible results achieved
by exit-counsellors such as Steve Hassan, and he breaks the cultic
spell using only speech.

Moreover, how about me? I came out of the cult due to exactly the kind
of information Barb is giving to the Sea Org kids.

'Never worked'? Really? So what works then?

Who is this 'we', Anonymous?

>People must realize the errors in their religion on
> their own, as you obviously have.

And how exactly can they do this when any data they need to evaluate
the reality is hidden from them by the cult? I'll tell you - people
like Barb can tell them.

>The only thing we can offer them is
> a second chance in the world.

We? Then your 'we' is just a bunch of wet lettuces. How about what WE
can offer them? For starters, we can offer them information, and we
can provide a support network when they leave.

>Religion is a deep seeded element of the
> human psychea.

Irrelevant. We're discussing the fraud known as scientology, not the
religiosity of humankind.

>Some of us posess no religious bounds, and can act more
> as mediators and without the emotion that religion can cause.

Mediators - what tools do they use to mediate? Oh yeah - they use the
power of SPEECH. And what makes you think you're a more effective
mediator just because you're not religious? You're being elitist and
disdainful.

>I would
> suggest you examine what I've said and possibly re-evaluate the way
> you're going about things.

And I would suggest you are an arrogant prick. Lurk moar, read some
books, learn about cults and exit-counselling, and maybe you'll know
what works and what doesn't, instead of assuming you know best. Speech
never got anyone out? Jesus Christ.

> I hate for you to look back on this and say
> it was fruitless because of the way you chose to contribute.

How gracious of you, trying to help like this. Arrogant prick.

Why the fuck are you trying to give Barb a failed purpose? And why the
fuck are you so 1.1? Are you for real?

butthurt fag is butthurt.

Zzzzz · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

sup doodz

ANON E MOOSE · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Long post is longggggggggggg.

Also, any chance of a source link. Im thinking this would be much easier to read where it originated from.

anonoblong · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

tl:dr

Thetanonymous · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

tl;dr - some of the "old guard" are butthurt that anonymous is coming in and getting attention for what they've been plugging away at for years. They don't trust us, they think we're suddenly going to lose interest and go follow the next shiny thing, they think the herd of cats is going to eff up all their carefully laid plans that just maybe another year or so of planning and another round of discussions will make workable.

Fuck 'em.

We have WBM. We have Magoo. We have Arnie Lerma. We have a good amount of the "old guard" who saw what was going on and realized that with the occasional nudge in the right direction (and more importantly, away from the wrong ones), the Awesome Power Of Anonymous could be harnessed, and Scientology could unleash the fucking fury on itself. (incidentally, is Yngwie Malmsteen a $cieno?)

Oinkertron9000 · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Actually I see some people being fucking idiots and attacking the old guard because some members of anonymous think they "know everything"

anon87 · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Unless this is an OSA scam to make me waste time scan reading i don't really see the point...

First poster: (mostly tl;dr) Seemed to be making some really good points, personal appeal to scilons reading it and a nice flowing style - good work, post moar.

Last poster: An Exscn '....a failed purpose? And why the fuck are you so 1.1? Are you for real?' is pure scilon, the rest of the post shows a slightly off centered view of life so they've probably not been out long enough to ditch all the old thought traps yet. They're mostly right but partly wrong.

Here's why i don't care - i just do my own thing, i think for myself -try to understand the issues and do the best thing i can to aid the cause. This means i read what others have to say, if they manage to change my opinion then that will change what i do. Someone thinks you can't talk someone out of a mental issue... haha i think to myself, you've not been part of a cult that uses fear and oppression to control your thought patterns have you? said cult doesn't HAET psychiatry does it? hmmmm....... (TROLL, TROLL, you're being glib, you don't understand psychiatry -I DO! (they tells me abouts it when i picked up ma check for being anon! £32.50!))

Simply facts on the issue, however the mind/soul/body combo works it doesn't change how we use it. If you put someone in an environment of positive affirmation, give them really complex books and tell them if they don't understand it to go look a word up in the dictionary then punish them (emotionally) if they disagree with 'the tech' but reward them if they 'get it' with praise and pride, you're then locking off the questions and systematically putting them out of mind. The deeper back those questions have been pushed the less likely they are to come to the surface on their own, enturbulating will cause some of the questions to awake -self actualization is the only thing which will make someone really change, the only way they will decide to do it is if they feel they need or want to, the only way they'll decide this is if they question what they're doing. The cult has set up a system to stop people being able to question themselves - #trust LRH# #the tech works# #You'll feel so good once you 'get it'.....# - we need to show them that questions can and must be asked, once they understand your question it becomes their question -a gift, they can keep forever.

This ^^^ is why i think anyone that's trolling scilons is doing a worthwhile thing - OSA might want everyone to stop, noobs might think it's a waste of time - my only question to the nay sayers - if you can't change someones actions through the power of words WTF DO THEY KEEP SPENDING ALL THAT MONEY ON ADVERTISING?!?!? The power of suggestion is strong, the power of education is OVERNINETHOUSAND!!! Ask them to answer your questions, ask good questions (include quotes, citations, etc if needed) and be nice about it - That night, the next day or maybe weeks later they'll think about the friendly person who asked the tough questions, they'll think about your question and they'll try and answer in honestly for themselves.

Does DM just waste all the money playing around in his Celeb Center and sailing his boats?

Why do so many people leave after doing the bridge?

How does this even remotely resemble a religion?

If the freezone have the same tech for free, why am i paying for it?

Where the hell's the door? i'm outa this dump!

Anon1OfLegion · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

I see Seeds of Discord BS.

Don't bite. Every Anon here knows we wouldn't know shit if it wasn't for the hard work & suffering of the old guard. All of the information we kick out & most all of the sites we link to are old guard sites. It's their effort that brought us here & cast this into the light of day. They should be proud.

BTW - I call BS on someone wanting all of the attention. That's all the scilons really want is a target & the old guard knows that.

Oinkertron9000 · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Anon1OfLegion said:

I see Seeds of Discord BS.

Don't bite. Every Anon here knows we wouldn't know shit if it wasn't for the hard work & suffering of the old guard. All of the information we kick out & most all of the sites we link to are old guard sites. It's their effort that brought us here & cast this into the light of day. They should be proud.

BTW - I call BS on someone wanting all of the attention. That's all the scilons really want is a target & the old guard knows that.

You got it, yep!

Especially after being 'butthurt' from the stats problem, they want a target, they WANT us to infight and lose sight of the goal.

scaryanonymous · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

^smart poster is smart.

Heyanonnyno · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Oinkertron9000 said:

Actually I see some people being fucking idiots and attacking the old guard because some members of anonymous think they "know everything"

Dude, I know. Some dipshits need to learn fucking respect. These people KNOW their shit.

SeaOrg Slut · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

scientology is the stupidest thing I ever got involved in it's a complete bullshit alien religion but if people want to believe in it that's fine with me. what really gets my goat is how they treat people on the inside. you are also both missing the fact that more than half the people who are 'in' the movement are all staff there's hardly any publics left at all they all realized what creepy bullshit it is at ot3 and left or they got to ot7 and got fucked out of a bunch of money and had to re-train again on the 'lost tech'

the old guard is so famous osa doesnt even bother to harass them anymore - just leave them be in their little usenet group

Heyanonnyno · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

SeaOrg Slut said:

scientology is the stupidest thing I ever got involved in it's a complete bullshit alien religion but if people want to believe in it that's fine with me. what really gets my goat is how they treat people on the inside. you are also both missing the fact that more than half the people who are 'in' the movement are all staff there's hardly any publics left at all they all realized what creepy bullshit it is at ot3 and left or they got to ot7 and got fucked out of a bunch of money and had to re-train again on the 'lost tech'

the old guard is so famous osa doesnt even bother to harass them anymore - just leave them be in their little usenet group

It's potential converts or 'wake-ups' like you that I want to help the most, SOS.

scaryanonymous · Feb 23, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Heyanonnyno said:

Oinkertron9000 said:

Actually I see some people being fucking idiots and attacking the old guard because some members of anonymous think they "know everything"

Dude, I know. Some dipshits need to learn fucking respect. These people KNOW their shit.

THAT is true, they do. But one thing I have discovered going through a research/discovery process is that the CO$ practiced the NEED TO KNOW policy. I have been told things from one source that another source will swear never happened. It's like the CO$ is a big giant prison with lots of teeny cells with people working away at assignments but not knowing what the guy next door is working on, not knowing, and not caring. I think that is partly responsible for the conflict of information I got. I have high source that says NO, not to this person's to personal knowlege were auditing and sec check files used against people, but I have close friend who got out who says YES...there must be a special blackmail squad that the others in the hive don't know about.

Magoo · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Barb has made that post for many years, actually. It has nothing to do with Anonymous---
it's to the kids of Scientology.

How the rest all got weird, I don't know---as I don't want to waste time reading blah blah blah.

Don't get into fights. Please don't bite on the trap of blaming "the old guard".
These people have stood for freedoms, many for YEARS. I always thank them, no matter what
they've been doing. Sometimes I *may* be more effective, but I never forget ANY of what I do is based
often on knowledge and experience they spent years gathering and sharing.
That's my 2 cents :alien: Also, remember OSA's goals:

1) Distraction off of Scientology--any way, any how.

2) Degrading each other---putting down each other, the old 'divide and conquer' routine

3) Slime the message board so people get so frustrated, they just don't want to post at all.

Keep 1, 2, 3 in mind----continue doing what you do best :anon: :guyfawkes: :anon:

And ROCK ON ANONYMOUS!!!!

My best,
Magoo~~~ 8)

ANON E MOOSE · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

The fact is, as has been mentioned previously.

Anon would not be able to take any of its current actions had all the facts not been close to hand. Had the old guard not placed all that information online at our fingertips it would not have gathered enough momentum to be where it is in such a fantastically short time. Scientology is so shocked by this it clings to the idea that such a revelation of personal understanding is impossible, that anonymous had to have been planning this for years.

The reason they cling so desperately to this is, should it be true, should people upon investigating scientology be so universally compelled to act with 0 organisation, they would have to accept that silencing criticism is now beyond their control.

By the very nature and constitution of anonymous, they hit upon something horrifically effective, something the old guard for all its incredible work had not considered, something as known critics they could not do. A new form of protest, one which focused on volume, and anonymity. The information that the old guard had and continues to gather is the sword. And anonymous is the hand that can wield it most effectively against the tactics of the COS. A pro scientology article goes up, within hours it is swamped with links to scientologies corruption and previous wrong doings. Even now we are getting reports that scientoogists are being shied away from the net. V-I day is on the far horizon. V-IRL day is much further away, but we know its there somewhere, over that same horizon.

The old guard is Kamina. Anonymous is Simon.

What we are doing could never have happened without them. And we are truly blessed to call them brother, because they had to fight a much harder war than we ever will. They have and will continue to push from below, and lead against the anti scientology movement from above, without the benefit of being anonymous, and thus immune to the enemy fire. And they know now, even if they all get sued to oblivion, even if every named critic is silenced by blackmail, persecution or even death, anonymous will go on, wielding the weapon which has been crafted for them. A weapon which can never be undone.

The truth.

RandomTexfag · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

ANON E MOOSE said:

The old guard is Kamina. Anonymous is Simon.

Protip for the Old Guard of Scientology Critics:

This is a reference to a Japanese cartoon that a lot of Anonymous watched called "Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann" (Heaven Piercing Gurren Lagann). The problem with this reference is what happens to Kamina in episode 8 :?

ANON E MOOSE · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

GAH NO SPOILERS.

And god willing that never becomes an issue. Unless the cos start building giant robots.

noitulover · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Here's the link to the ARS thread:
http://tinyurl.com/2g4uxj

Barb Graham is not an OP! She is a long-time critic of the Church. :applause:

She is also a chaplain of the ARSCC(wdne). :wink:

Her credentials are verified by the fact that she has her own page on the cult's hate-site, Religious Freedom Watch.

She posts this message to Sea Org kids every weekend, in the hopes that some of them will see it during their 'libs' -- their time off to get their personal shopping done -- usually only a few hours on Saturday or Sunday afternoon. For this alone, she deserves our respect.

The cult recently complained to her ISP, claiming she was spamming ARS -- a good indication that her post has reached at least a few Sea Org kids. You can gauge how successful this post is by the amount of opposition she gets to it.

Other posters show up on the weekend and bump her post to keep it on the first page (for those using Google Groups) -- you are all welcome to come out and play in the sandbox, just don't shit in it :wink:

You know, we are really, really new to this fight. These people have been in the trenches for years and years. They are teaching, we are learning.

Like that old Chinese saying goes, "you make yourself deaf when you talk too much."

madashell · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Can we please just get over this shit. Agree we have different methods and move on. .the 15th is drawing closer.

MegaTurboStalin · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Heyanonnyno said:

Oinkertron9000 said:

Actually I see some people being fucking idiots and attacking the old guard because some members of anonymous think they "know everything"

Dude, I know. Some dipshits need to learn fucking respect. These people KNOW their shit.

I don't know why people would be getting into arguments with the Old Guard at all. I can understand the OG being angry about not being able to achieve what we could. But both sides NEED to cooperate and respect each other or we both lose.

And don't say "fuck em", there's a little thing called DIPLOMACY and the smallest insult can create huge fissures in relationships.

HerrdoktorKrud · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

MegaTurboStalin said:

And don't say "fuck em", there's a little thing called DIPLOMACY and the smallest insult can create huge fissures in relationships.

I support this post.

Someone before made an analogy of this relationship like two cultures. I can see that, and I'd like to take it a bit further.
I think of it like an arch. Or, if you will, "The Bridge to Freedom". CoS is on one side, the rest of the world is on the other. The next stone up in the arch is, on the "World" side, the media and investigative journalism. On the CoS side, it is the OG. They keystone is Anonymous.
Usually, that could all fit together and be great, except that the OG is fractured and splintered (by necessity). So, the architectural support that should be there, is, well, not. So, as members of Anon and the OG, we need to find the mortar that will connect the pieces together, as well as to connect the OG stone to the Anon stone.
So, while the bulk of Anon takes the received information and processes it into what it needs to be (as well as finding new info), there also need to be links (mortar) between the various factions of OG and Anon that can find the strongest links and filter out the empty spaces and bullshit.

Not a "need to know" system, but just a system where those who can deal with it can filter out the garbage and turn it into usable information.

I'm not calling for assigning duties to people at all. Rather, just an idea. Those of you who can handle the conspiracy theories and tinfoil-hattery of the Old Guard, please, take it upon yourselves to venture there and gather intel. Then report back with your findings.
As well, members of the Old Guard who are well spoken and don't need to hide behind secrecy, please, come here and tell us what you know. Magoo is an excellent example of that. She tells us good information that we can then process for the media. And she knows how to say it well.
That's why we love her <3 <3 <3

Anyone and everyone, please feel free to pick apart my ramblings and form it into something solid and cohesive, and above all, something that will SMITE THE SHIT out of David Miscavige.

SeaOrg Slut · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Here is how you determine which "Old Guard" NOT to listen to

* are they a fan of the Minton style of demonstrating (swastikas, hitler images referring to Hubbard etc)?
* have they never attended a demonstration EVER?
* do they simply find it easier to talk out their ass and be critical behind a keyboard without ANY relative experience what-so-ever in the movement?

there's your formula - you've just eliminated 70% of the people who post on ARS. Congrats, enjoy the 12 critics who you can still talk to!

RedPillonTopix · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Thetanonymous said:

tl;dr - some of the "old guard" are butthurt that anonymous is coming in and getting attention for what they've been plugging away at for years. They don't trust us, they think we're suddenly going to lose interest and go follow the next shiny thing, they think the herd of cats is going to eff up all their carefully laid plans that just maybe another year or so of planning and another round of discussions will make workable.

Fuck 'em.

We have WBM. We have Magoo. We have Arnie Lerma. We have a good amount of the "old guard" who saw what was going on and realized that with the occasional nudge in the right direction (and more importantly, away from the wrong ones), the Awesome Power Of Anonymous could be harnessed, and Scientology could unleash the fucking fury on itself. (incidentally, is Yngwie Malmsteen a $cieno?)

You're misinterpreting the Old Guard. They're thrilled with Anonymous, but yes there is some concern that some Anons will get bored and wander off.

HerrdoktorKrud · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

BTW, SOS, here is an image you can use for your avatar (I made the white background clear).

Edit:

RedPillonTopix said:

You're misinterpreting the Old Guard. They're thrilled with Anonymous, but yes there is some concern that some Anons will get bored and wander off.

That's the great thing about Anonymous. Some wander off, but others join in. There is no personality or identity here. It's all a matter of numbers.

RedPillonTopix · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

RedPillonTopix said:

RedPillonTopix said:

Thetanonymous said:

tl;dr - some of the "old guard" are butthurt that anonymous is coming in and getting attention for what they've been plugging away at for years. They don't trust us, they think we're suddenly going to lose interest and go follow the next shiny thing, they think the herd of cats is going to eff up all their carefully laid plans that just maybe another year or so of planning and another round of discussions will make workable.

Fuck 'em.

We have WBM. We have Magoo. We have Arnie Lerma. We have a good amount of the "old guard" who saw what was going on and realized that with the occasional nudge in the right direction (and more importantly, away from the wrong ones), the Awesome Power Of Anonymous could be harnessed, and Scientology could unleash the fucking fury on itself. (incidentally, is Yngwie Malmsteen a $cieno?)

You're misinterpreting the Old Guard. They're thrilled with Anonymous, but yes there is some concern that some Anons will get bored and wander off. Arnie Lerma, Magoo, and WBM are three of the six or so biggest critics. They're obviously backing you, so trust in the rest of us to fall into line.

SeaOrg Slut · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

I'm not sure why this is an issue anyway people in anonymous seem smart enough to ignore the stupid and the annoying so why not just do that and go on with life?

PS

thanks for the avatar

hartley patterson · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

Oh goodness. ARS is a snakepit, full of flame wars and feuds and stuff. Picking a mild spat that lasted one Thread and making a thing of it does not bode well!
People with 'anon' in their name are going to get flamed too, especially if they are trolls or OSA. Everyone gets treated the same, so don't worry that any single Anonymous is going to spoil things for the rest.

In one respect ARS is however different, and it's the most obvious one - people post as personas, not anons. To understand a lot of what's going on you have to know who the people are, and as in a bar the people who talk the most aren't always the ones that you should be paying most attention to.

anonymous3347 · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

HerrdoktorKrud said:

MegaTurboStalin said:

And don't say "fuck em", there's a little thing called DIPLOMACY and the smallest insult can create huge fissures in relationships.

So, while the bulk of Anon takes the received information and processes it into what it needs to be (as well as finding new info), there also need to be links (mortar) between the various factions of OG and Anon that can find the strongest links and filter out the empty spaces and bullshit.
I'm not calling for assigning duties to people at all. Rather, just an idea. Those of you who can handle the conspiracy theories and tinfoil-hattery of the Old Guard, please, take it upon yourselves to venture there and gather intel. Then report back with your findings.
.

I'd be happy to act as a go-between, because I've nothing but time. But I tried to register yesterday over on OCMB and it still won't let me in.

Anonproto · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

HerrdoktorKrud said:

That's the great thing about Anonymous. Some wander off, but others join in. There is no personality or identity here. It's all a matter of numbers.

some join the enemy, some join the allies... the humor is that by its very nature some anon will provide "up stat" for their trolling of the OG - ignore them!

Annie Mouse · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

anonymous3347 said:

I'd be happy to act as a go-between, because I've nothing but time. But I tried to register yesterday over on OCMB and it still won't let me in.

I waited more than six months before my OC account was approved. Some had an even longer wait, as Andreas was very busy last year and all new registrations were put on hold. But it appears that he is back "on the job," so to speak, as he has actively opened numerous anon accounts in just the past week. Just be patient.

musketeerwang · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

I'd suggest lurking on ARS but not posting. It's not "our" world. If you want to liaise with old guard, do it here or on OCMB.

DJR245 · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

ARS is so fucked-up.

I keep thinking I should be reading it because that's where all the "inside" info first breaks, but everytime I try I just get lost in these longass bickering cross-accusations and everyone's gigantic paranoid signatures. OSA should get a medal for making that newsgroup totally and completely incomprehensible to casual users. I sure hope other lines of communication don't go the same way.

Thetanonymous · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

RedPillonTopix said:

You're misinterpreting the Old Guard. They're thrilled with Anonymous, but yes there is some concern that some Anons will get bored and wander off. Arnie Lerma, Magoo, and WBM are three of the six or so biggest critics. They're obviously backing you, so trust in the rest of us to fall into line.

I'm not saying "Fuck 'em" to the OG - I'm saying say "Fuck 'em" to those members of the OG who have seen it fit to spread disinformation through Anonymous, or who want to keep their super seekrits to themselves while saying "I have seekrit documents! Neener neener neener!". We say "Fuck 'em" to these people because it's a waste of time to deal with them. Hopefully they'll come around in to our way of..uh...hivemind thought, but if they don't it's not like Anonymous just stops.

There are those among the OG who see Anonymous as what it is, are psyched about it, and can see the instant benefits both sides get if we work together. These people are truly, truly awesome, and my initial post was not meant to reflect poorly on them.

HerrdoktorKrud · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

hartley patterson said:

In a bar the people who talk the most aren't always the ones that you should be paying most attention to.

That is a beautiful quote. Thank you. :wink:

Bumblefuck · Feb 24, 2008

Re: Morons on A.R.S

We're all in this together. The old guard, though not anonymous, are valuable allies of ours in the war on the CoS. (locky locky)

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