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Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

Discussion in 'News and Current Events' started by Anonymous9999, Feb 23, 2008.

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  1. Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    We as in ANON (here at Enturb since I am not active anywhere else and I like others here could not possbily understand or know the CODE that ANON operated under prior to this movement.)

    And that is correct, it will be damaging and I hope that if there is any intent towards that any person considering such a thing would think twice about loosing credibility.

    But the only thing i have read on here that I have not seen backed up by my own personal experiences or other documentation are insiders leaking emails with personal info deleted, and of course the now infamous Maracabian Fleet.

    And no, the capability of ANY ANON to process opinions and information would never be shocking to me. It's what has made this thing successful thus far.

    The poster you speak of will sink or swim on his own merit and will either learn to accomodate the communication style of the people he is trying to communicate with or he won't. Doing so would make him more effective (he's pissed me off a time or two), however we cannot force someone to change what and how they've been doing things, we can only ask that they do.
  2. MollyBloom Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy


    That's why I am asking for clarification because it's a logical conclusion that is from the OG when the paragraph it exists in talks about information held by some of the OG.



    Again, I understand the secrecy, I understand their need to not divulge information but if some in the OG are claiming that status of "knowing" and purposely feeding anonymous disinformation to sway anonymous then that is wrong.


    His post is sketchy, many are seeing it in different ways. He has a choice, let it stand in misunderstanding or state his thoughts more succinctly. <shrug>
  3. Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    I totally understand your point, but if people have been reading his posts for any length of time, they know he is not likely to be bullied into anything, had I had seen his post and believed he was alluding to "using ANON to diseminate false information to the CO$, I would have told him that I felt that was wrong and not listened a word he said afterwards. I believe he was saying SOME PEOPLE are feeding false information, and we know that is true. However egoistic I might find that particular poster I don't see that he would be foolish enough to come into this crowd and state he is or someone is feeding us false information.

    He also not likely to be bullied into any clarification either just based on what I've read of his posts to this point.
  4. MollyBloom Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy



    Yea, I am such a big bully. :mrgreen:


    If I was a few years younger I would "bully" you, Scary. :wink:
  5. Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy


    And trust me when I say that SKEERS ME, BEHOLD the POWER OF THE BLUE HAIRS :mrgreen:
  6. Anonamour Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    You guys fuckin ROCK!
  7. anonymous3347 Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    After I read the first posts in this thread, I was in a cold, percolating fury. Luckily, I needed a cigarette and the break gave me a chance to think.

    This is what will divide us, if we let it. No, I don't like the idea of disinformation being passed to Anonymous. It makes me feel as though I were being used as a tool.

    I have come to love and respect many members of the Old Guard. I have been impressed with what they had to say, most of the time. But they are either our equal partners in this fight, or they are not. They have to decide about that.

    That said, FUCK this noise. Fuck the tinfoil, fuck the secrets, fuck the namefagging. I'm not saying fuck the Old Guard. But FUCK the division this may be causing.

    Stuff your butthurt, quit the BAWWWing, call the whaaaambulance. Then get back to work. There is war to be made, there are lulz to be had, and somewhere, there is someone who is depending on Anonymous to deliver. Someone getting gnawed on by roaches or starving, being raped, being beaten. Not even Doom music can make that funny.
  8. madashell Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Fuck it this says all i was trying to say.. thanks above poster

    Stuff your butthurt, quit the BAWWWing, call the whaaaambulance. Then get back to work. There is war to be made, there are lulz to be had, and somewhere, there is someone who is depending on Anonymous to deliver. Someone getting gnawed on by roaches or starving, being raped, being beaten. Not even Doom music can make that funny.
  9. Anonymousfoil Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Person A: "Vague statement, could be misconstrued."

    Person B: "Person A's statement clearly makes him an Ass."

    Person C:" Nuh uh, you misunderstand."

    Person B: "Oh yeah?"

    Person C: "Yeah!"

    Person B: "Oh yeah?"

    Person C: "Yeah!"

    Person B: "Oh yeah?"

    Person C: "Yeah!"

    Person B: "Oh yeah?"

    Person C: "Yeah!"

    Person B: "Oh yeah?"

    Person C: "Yeah!"

    Person B: "Oh yeah?"

    Person C: "Yeah!"

    Person B: "Oh yeah?"

    Person C: "Yeah!"

    Person B: "Oh yeah?"

    Person C: "Yeah!"

    Person B&C: "Ya know what, we are both being asses." *Kissyhugface*


    One unclear statement spawned way too many posts from two people. You were not discussing, you were campaigning. This is not helpful to Anon. This is not how hive mind functions. This is what we purposefully try to avoid here. This is FAIL!



    Now on topic. It must be admitted that we are facing the clash of two distinct cultures here. The OG has their way of doing things, and it works well for them. Anon has our way of doing things, and it works well for us. The main thrust of true leaderless resistance is that we never try too hard to combine these distinct factions into one movement, we simply expect that either side is going to do whatever the hell they decide to do. Input from either side is welcome, but not required, and not mandatory. We cannot make the OG become more like Anon, and we should not try too. Versa-Vice as well.

    The OG is no more a single united entity than Anon is. If some of the OG are accustomed to playing mind games thats great. If they want to continue playing mind games also great. If they want to use Anon as their vehicle to distribute misinfo THEY WILL FUCKING PAY! End of story. (Take heed Old Gaurd, its not personal, but it will not end well if we are misused.)

    I personally did not read the post in question as an admission of using us to distribute misinfo, although it was hinted at. Perhaps that is for the benefit of OSA, perhaps not. In either case it is requested that the poster in question clarify their stance.

    That said WBM and Magoo have been invaluable in their current roles as critics. They give us their opinions as critics. We accept their opinion as critics. IF they want to roll a new account and be Anon they are welcome to, but I suspect they do not yet understand that we are a den of vipers and only the strong survive. It is our way.

    I am completely ok with an OG releasing insider info based upon their OG status. This does not mean instant acceptance, merely that some creedance is given to the info. I am not ok with an Anon trying to claim OG status and release (or hint at possession of) OG info. IF you are an OG posting as an Anon you get the exact same standing as the rest of us here, which is exactly none.


    tl;dr OG is OG and Anon is Anon. It works fine that way. If OG wanna come forewards and namefag themselves they get extra credit and protection from Anon. IF an OG wants to post Anon they get no special treatment.
  10. Anonymite Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Alright, so here's what the dealio is on my opinion.

    To all those who know not what I refer to when i state the secret code of anonymous, just look up Anonymous on encyclopediadramatica. You'll find what you need there.

    Ok, as to our relationship with the Old Guard. WE ARE NOT A TOOL. Anonymous is no one's personal army. We rose up to this battle of our own accord, for our own reasons. Anyone who has joined Anonymous has joined for their reasons. One thing we didn't joined for was to be used. We aren't going to follow any orders; Anonymous will make its decisions as a group, and will act as a group, and no outsider will change that unless he wants to be Anonymous and throw his opinions in.

    I, personally, am deeply offended at the concept that Anonymous has been used to disseminate false information. Are you saying that we are NOT considered the fourth marcabian invasion fleet? Or maybe the false info was that 18 people did not in fact leave scientology and go straight to Lerma? How in the hell do we trust ANYTHING that's been reported to us now?

    My trust is betrayed. I still have the utmost respect for the critics that I've seen or interacted with; WBM, Magoo, and Mr. Henson. Anyone else, well, I'm just going to consider them lieing until proven otherwise. Pics or it didn't happen. Not your personal army. Anonymous came into here fully willing to assist and interact and TRUST the Old Guard. How in the hell was it decided that it was a good idea to feed us info to confuse the OSA when they would probably KNOW if the info was false or not? And if you're going to withhold critical information from us, fine, but don't freaking tell us that! You guys earned our trust by being out there and fighting the good fight since we were in diapers, and you've betrayed it.

    tl;dr: You guys just acted like complete assholes, lied to us, and seem to be more than willing to treat us as your own army to use and misinform. WE'RE NOT. Shape up, and treat Anonymous as a single, EQUAL entity, or there's going to be another thing coming, you deuschbags.
  11. Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    The OP has an interesting point about remaining anonymous.

    But, enturbulation is just one place for things to be discussed. Anonymous is anonymous regardless of what happens on this site.

    Personally, I find the site useful as a public-friendly location to direct people to. I find ED and Partyvan very funny, but I don't want to link them on my fliers. Ultimately, they're just different options, but not competitive ones, we can have both.
  12. J. Swift Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    The OG is actively encouraging, praising, and supporting Anonymous. If some Anons perceive an unbalanced power equation, then that is going on in their heads. If you can work a keyboard and want to fight Scientology, then we are equals in the cause. Certainly, the OG does possess far more knowledge and experience regarding the subject of Scientology than Anonymous. However, Anonymous wields vast expertise, experience, and power in waging large-scale asymmetrical internet warfare. The OG could never do this. We love Anonymous for taking on the fight with us. I see OG and Anonymous as the two sides of the same coin. The two groups complement each other's respective strengths. There is no uneven power equation. There are different approaches, but there is no inequality. There is a definite generational conflict going on, but that happens in every generation.

    If anyone has a problem with my particular style as a critic, then don't read my posts. It is that simple. I do what I do for free and you can take it or leave it. I don't care either way. BTW, I was very careful to preface my most recent "Radio Silence" post and tell readers to not accept this information uncritically. I invited both the OG and Anonymous to vet the data:

    /////
  13. random Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    too much panic
    you lack filters

    each opinion aka fact is presented as is. no warranties.
    maybe is true, maybe is troll.
    all data must be cross filtered with your available sources and your belief radar

    everything in internet isn´t true. like there are no little girls in the irc chats.

    example: media is owned by corporations, so media publish corporation approved data.
    example: spai is owned by group, so data releases in time are group approved data.

    that leave us with:
    1) fetch data stand alone complex way
    2) apply filtering: do you have sauce? links or gtfo
    3) verify integrity
    4) broadcast
    5) ?????

    anonymous isn´t a puppet. maybe a loud speaker in the back of a cardboard cone.
  14. Anonamour Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Random you forget

    6) Profit

    :lrhmoney:
  15. SeaOrg Slut Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    not that im a fan of the 'old guard' but why do you even care?
  16. Anonymous9999 Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Really? Then why do you want special treatment?

    Like, say, right here:

    What I'm telling you is that while taking part in Anonymous discussions, you have been recieving special treatment, and encouraged it, by means of crap just like this. We should avoid internal criticism, internal confrontation, and grouchiness just for you? Because, make no mistake, internal criticism, confrontation, and grouchiness are valid and valuable parts of the way we channel feedback and do analysis.

    Being an asshole doesn't make someone wrong - not the person snarking at you, nor you. Avoiding confrontation with your ideas, and trying not to drop you into the meat grinder when you're right here, in our arguments, IS special treatment.

    We can't afford to give special treatment; it screws up how we work.

    We can't afford to deny ourselves information, like the stuff you HAVE shared.

    See the conflict?
  17. Anonproto Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    yes, especially the criticism part

    the OG should take their "web of trust" and communicate the highly confidential information with themselves as they see fit... treating everything given to Anon as if it were handed to OSA and DM (which OG has largely understood to be the reality)


    the other problem is that Anon is flighty and prone to turn on a dime. One anon is your ally now they will reg another account and troll the shit out of you just to get a reaction (for the lulz). This is what anon is. Anon will post videos criticizing "the Anonymous movement". Hell I'm surprised we haven't seen a chan invasion on enturb.


    Anon is a multi-headed beast... one head will purr and the other will bite and there's no avoiding one to get the other. OG needs to be hardened to this reality and not be offended by the criticism. There is no trust here.
  18. J. Swift Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    If Anonymous9999 wishes to attack me publicly then he or she is certainly free to do so. Anonymous is all about free speech and I support Anonymous9999's right to criticize me. My right to free speech here at Enturbulation.org has been fully supported and so I have no problem with contrary, or even hostile, points of view that criticize my particular approach. This the essence of free speech and it distinguishes us from groups such as Scientology. The OG welcomes and encourage Anons to speak over at OCMB. Lively debate, disagreement, good dialogue, and an increased understanding result from the free flow of conversation.

    As to critical thinking, Anonymous, OCMB, ESMB, ARS, Lermanet, and the other anti-Scientology websites excel at critical thinking and have produced a large body of excellent work exposing Scientology. This is why major media contacts our respective boards for interviews, quotes, and to do background research.

    Just for the record, once again, I apologize to people whom I have upset. If I got off on the wrong foot at Enturbulation,org, it was my own ignorance of the Anonymous culture. I am not from your group and did not understand the social mores that are in effect here. Now that I have been informed of what is appropriate behavior at this board, I will comport myself to the social mores in my future visits. I will also stop posting the inside information on Scientology that I discover and urge my colleagues at OCMB to do likewise. You can go read it at OCMB where we specialize in collecting and posting inside information that exposes Scientology's latest actions in real time. Conversely, we will come here to get our instructions for March 15.

    I ask Anons to please come over to OCMB and explain Anonymous to us so that we can understand where you are coming from. I would be interested in reading what you have done in the past, I would like to understand your intellectual and sociocultural framework for social action. Both sides need to work to avoid misunderstandings.

    /////
  19. Anonymous9999 Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Then we're cool - especially if you understand that "Anonymous ripping up shit you say" does not in any way translate into "Anonymous doesn't like me".

    In many cases, it's very much the opposite. The more attention we pay, the more your shit might get ripped up.
  20. anonymous3347 Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    J. Swift:
    If someone doesn't like your posts, then it is doubly critical that they read them. We have got to have many people who think differently about things. If we all agreed, we'd be like some of those old-era activist groups that haven't gotten anything really important accomplished in years.
    It is vitally important that we read what anyone says, and then rip it to shreds, hopefully with minimal bitching. That's how we find the right way to go. So, yes, each post gets read with a critical eye and commented on, so don't feel like you are being flamed, we're just smelting the ore to get at the steel.

    OG and Anonymous:
    I don't think the issue is so much about perceived power imbalances as it is about credibility. One's cred is very important online, because that's all anyone has to go on. Screen names, handles, tags, whatever you want to call yourself by online, that's just a placeholder; the real deal is in what you do, what you say. Many people have automatically given instant cred to the Old Guard, based on what we've seen out of Mark, Tory and Arnie. As other of the OG are beginning to trust us, some of them are coming over here. They will have to earn their cred, the same as anyone else.

    Anonymous:
    What does it matter if some of the inside reports aren't 100% of all of the information that they have? The hinting twists my tits, and I wish that would come to an end immediately. The prospect of having been lied to pisses me off, too. But what does it affect? How can anyone use Anonymous as a tool? In what way could we possibly been used as a tool? We were in this before the Old Guard showed up, just like they were in this before we showed up. I have done nothing based on what someone else said; I've done what I've thought was right, once I started reading the information that has piled up over the years.

    tl;dr To everyone: Don't get butthurt if your posts get shredded, don't fuck up your credibility, don't be gullible, don't do anything based on the say of someone else.

    Infighting is the fertilizer of lateral thinking, and I am glad this has been talked about. Just don't get carried away with it. :guyfawkes:
  21. Artonymous Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Well, a quick note here:

    Check the ED entry for camwhore for basic points on this.

    Basically in anonymous boards you get a lot of people posting cries for attention. Of course, the great bulk of them are whiny, attention seeking liars. To counter this, the policy of "(pics/dox/youtube) or it didn't happen" became the consensus. Proof has to be supplied just about instantly.

    Now, a few people came on here with inside information on how the church leadership was running scared. All fine and good, but some people can see it as:

    "OMG I like totally got this super sekrit inside info!EPIC WIN LULZ! They totally told me about how cool we were! But I can talk gotta stay sekrit LISTEN FOR MOAR!"

    Now, I'm not saying that this is what actually happened. I'd like to think that all the information posted here is accurate and that everyone is being honest. I'm just saying Anon's threshold for proof is generally much higher then taking someone's word on something. The very nature of Anon means that noone can have that much credibility to start out with.

    The resent inside leaks are, of course, wonderful news when they can be verified. Up until then, they'll be subject to both praise and abuse. This is a normal part of how Anon's thought process works. Offense is intended, but being Anon means having a very high tolerance for offense.

    Information on secret leaks, etc., are better suited for OG boards IMO. Once some kind of documentation has been established, we'd love to see it.

    tl;dr Thanks for the info but we'll work out if we believe it on our own.
  22. BHX Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    None of this is helpful.
    Not to Anon.
    And not to OG.
    And not to the objective.
    But I bet OSA is happy.

    Carry on.
  23. AnonMomAnon Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    here's the thing:
    the clearwater organizers know more about why i can't go into more detail about why i knew what i knew, but it was info that i think they were happy to get and the information that i sent them did what i wanted it to: it made them more at ease with what was going to happen on feb. 10th.

    i have the greatest respect and confidence in our clearwater organizers and i hope that they feel the same about me.
  24. realitybites Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    In general I agree with the OP. I have great respect for the "Old Guard" and what they have achieved so far, and what they have gone through. But, as the OP has suggested, and from other posts in the forum, there seems to be a bit much focus on these "mystery sources" and "rumors of inner turbulence" etc. It would absolutely be epic if they were true.. but "pics or GTFO" and "Anonymous does not believe in pixels" should hold until verified. Even Tori herself has stated: Keep focused on the goal. All the other news is possible icing on "delicious" cake if it does eventuate.

    Another sidepoint: the current 'movement' is Anonymous driven with many new 'Anonimi (?)' joining in. I strongly believe that the original Anonymous should be kept in, and not driven away by the over seriousness of language and tone (even though the target is as serious as a heart attack). The lulz to be gained is a major component of the movement, and I really hope that we all remember it. After all, as Anonymous grows and morphs into who-knows-what, we must and should remember that the core/orginators are a major reason that Anonymous has been able to change so quickly, to turn on a dime, to organize so rapidly...

    Then again I could just be talking out of my butt...
  25. madashell Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Get over this useless shit and concentrate on the goal.
  26. Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Thanks for "clearing" that up JSwift. Much appreciated.
  27. Green Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Avoid wearing tinfoil hats and stick to the truth and nobody has anything to worry about.
  28. MollyBloom Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    No one is asking you to apologize and no one is telling you that you have to 'act' like anonymous here, all anyone is trying to say is that you have to understand how anonymous works and not worry about the manner in which anonymous rips posts apart.


    I don't understand your "fine then, I will take my ball now go home and tell my friends not to come play here too" attitude that comes across in this post. Perhaps I am misunderstaning your intent.


    Your informational post are welcome and will be digested in the same manner that everything is digested, pics or GTFO is not just an anonymous phenomena, you encounter it on most message boards, it's just a way of saying "I'll believe it when I see it." This is nothing to get bent out of shape over.

    The only thing that is of concern is the idea that some OG members may possibly feeding anonymous disinformation under the guise of "we have been doing this for years, listen to us" authority. All you need to do is post what you have, let anonymous chew it over and come to their own conclusions about validity and how the information fits into the goal.


    I have lurked daily over at OCMB and I have seen the same thing going on over there, members there put out info there are some there that say, "wow, if this is true" (emphasis on if) then whoohoo CoS is crumbling and others that say, "hey wait a minute, how can we verify this?" People there rip into possible OSA posts the same way that anonymous rips into every suspect post here. It's really no different, but that's your "home" so you feel comfortable there. <shrug>


    So, after that rambling, what's my point?
    No need for you to stop posting info,
    No need for you to change your behavior,
    No need for you to leave,
    Iput what you can to work towards great justice,
    Just go with the flow and let anonymous digest.



    *It's early, hope this makes sense, there is never enough coffee on Sunday morning to sweep away all of the cobwebs. :mrgreen:
  29. mudkipstoat23 Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Both groups need to remember a couple of things. We Anons need to remember what the OG have been through and achieved, and that they have their own way of doing things. The OG need to remember that Anonymous takes nothing on trust. It's not personal- you could tell us that the sun rose this morning, and we'd probably STILL say "pics or it didn't happen". If we're picking apart things you're saying, then as somebody mentioned above, it probably means we have MOAR interest in what you're saying. Remember, a lot of us come from boards where multiple posts will be claiming to be from the OP, and aren't, boards composed of "artistic works of fiction and falsehood", which "only a fool would take... as fact" We take NOTHING on trust. Remember also, we only have anyone's own word to go on that they are who they say they are. This is the Internet, after all.

    You guys do what you have to do; we'll do what we have to do. As long as we're helping, and not hindering, each other, everything'll be just fine.

    The most important thing is that both groups respect each other. Hell, even if we disagree, we're disagreeing with our ALLIES, not our enemies, and from those disagreements new approaches will emerge. It's a dialectic. Yes, people like Magoo and WBM have a lot of respect here. They also afford Anonymous the same respect. That's how it works; it's a two-way street. And that's aimed at BOTH sides.

    And yes, it's good that this is being discussed now. If there are issues they should be dealt with, rather than left to fester into something that could destroy us later on.

    tl;dr?

    Let's quit squabbling. We've got a cult to bring down.
  30. Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    I don't think any of us would purposely aim disinformation at Anonymous in the hope of steering them in a particular direction, rather that Anonymous could pick up on disinformation aimed at the cult, either new stuff or old stuff - false data can hang around uncorrected on the Internet forever. The cult of course is and will be throwing up all kinds of chaff and flares as it tries to find Anonymous' ruin, collectively and individually.

    People also make jokes that can be taken literally, particularly by newcomers for whom Scientology is so weird that it's impossible to distinguish truth from fiction. No, I don't think the Sea Org believes the flying saucers from Markab are about to land, that was a joke referring to, ahem, a moment back in the 80s IIRC when some of them did.
  31. Cockleblocker Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Tell us the sooper sekrit password to get in. I've been trying to get my login approved since November 2006. Who do you have to blow to get in there?
  32. MollyBloom Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Cool Beans, hartley, thank you so much for clearing that up.


    Most of us understand this and anyone on the net for any length of time learns to discern what is sense and what is nonsense, what is noise and what is signal and when we don't we badger and dig till we 'get it'. No harm or foul is intended.

    Well if you have read the Markab thread here on Enturb you will see that most took it as a joke (although some were not aware of the origins of the post) and much lulz was had by all. :mrgreen:
  33. Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    It can be difficult to get an account over there, but Andreas seems to be admitting a few Anons in the spirit of our union. Try re-applying. It helps if your real name is in the email address.

    If you manage to get an account, my name is 'JonDoe' there. Don't confuse me with the OCMB poster 'RedPill.'
  34. Cockleblocker Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    That sounds reasonable RedPillonTopix. +500 free internets to you.
  35. Anonymous9999 Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    I registered as "John Thetan" about a week ago. I haven't been approved.
  36. Anonproto Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    HAY GUYS IZ DIS SUM "COOM BUY YAAA MAH LAWD" SHIT GOIN ON HERE?

    :( no! we must give OSA more up-stats! ;) :) :lrhtalking: :lrhcries:

    :anon: :anon: :anon: :anon:
  37. xenubarb Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    One think the OG knows well is something you're going to learn. Some of you already are learning it, as evidenced by the Fair Game thread in General Topics.

    You've heard about Paulette Cooper, but have you heard of Jesse Prince? Or Tom Klemesrud?
    Both were approached by friendly people in bars, but it could happen anywhere. To you, even.
    Would you trust someone you met after a raid if they held a GF mask in their hands?

    Jesse was framed for cultivating marijuana. In August, when most plants are a mile high (or so I'm told) he was busted for 'manufacturing drugs,' a serious charge. There was a spindly, portable marijuana plant in his yard. Turns out his new "friend" was a PI hired by Scientology.

    And Tom Klemesrud, well, you'd have to read his story to believe it. Google 'miss bloodybutt.'

    I've had suspicious encounters. Friendly fellow outside the grocery store hailed me and walked to my door. I declined to "go for coffee" and shut the door on him. Another time, it was a total stranger wanting to invite me out on a motorcycle ride. Later, in a fit of remorse, he told me via email that his kids were still "in," and OSA made me his amends project.

    OG has good reason for paranoia. If you stick around, you will too. The cult would love to get you jailed. I think they get extra rice n' beans if they succeed. Yeah, it's a different culture between OG and Anonymous. You might get your feelings hurt if you don't understand it, like little Matt, who dragged a whole thread to this mb so you could all kiss his booboos. It's locked now, and just as well. We can work together. While there are a few OG who seem to view the Scientology battle as their personal sandbox, they are the minority. Most of us are just happy as clams that Anonymous has decided to take on this vicious criminal organization masquerading as a religion. Watch the people who are trying to drive a wedge between us and ask yourself, "Now who would want to do that?" Outside of a few egotists on both sides, the answer is obvious. And it has clams all over it.
  38. Anonymous9999 Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    A bit of this, combined with a big healthy dollop of "trying to become one and the same thing is bad for both cultures", is what I was originally trying to get at.
  39. xenubarb Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    I don't think we'll ever become "one and the same." The lines will blur where our cultures intersect. Your experiences will become as ours. We don't really *have* a culture on ARS.
    Some of us know each other, but it's pretty much a collection of individuals with one thing in common. We have the luxury of knowing each other, liking some and despising others.
    You have the luxury of anonymity. You do a lot of slick videos. We do a lot of media stuff in print.

    Actually, we're not that different from Anonymous. Except we don't share the same face: :guyfawkes:
  40. Anonymous9999 Member

    Re: Old Guard, Status, Secrecy

    Not true.

    The culture is about personal relationships and personal, individual trust, based on reliability and reputation.

    In short, it's an identity-based culture. Which is almost the exact opposite of Anonymous.

    Which is why mixing the cultures is dangerous.
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