Operation: Nightlight

Discussion in 'Projects' started by Theanonymoustipster, Apr 21, 2008.

  1. waitwhat Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    My recommendation is a marine deep cycle battery. it's the type favoured by the GRL in NYC.
    I'd go with something like this

    Image:Grl laser bike.jpg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    info here

    To run a good laser or projector we'd also need an inverter. With a charge controller we could charge the thing from any car battery. Actually we could just run it from a car.
  2. Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Well in the email, I enquired as to its power source, and whether or not they could provide one with it. I suspect they cannot, but they can tell us the sort of thing we are looking for.
  3. Theta Omega Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Well, there are a couple of things you need to be careful of.

    Firstly, you can only draw about fifteen amps from a car lighter socket, which means you only get about 200 watts. Since you're going to want more than this (for example, that xenon spotlight thing was 1400 watts, and most DLP projectors are about 500 or so, with high power ones being more like 900) you're not going to be able to power it off the car without substantial (like 2/0 gauge) wires going directly to the battery.

    Secondly, even then, most cars won't supply that much power with the engine at idle, so you will need to rev the engine to keep the alternator going, which will eat a lot of fuel and probably overheat most cars. Some cars can't even supply the sort of power you're looking at (75 amps for a 900 watt projector like the Viewsonic PJ1158). You will find it easier to get a small 1200 watt generator. They're not expensive, tool hire places rent them, and they won't namefag you- just go there a couple of days ahead of time, plunk down your deposit and walk out with a shiny new generator. They're also lighter, cheaper and easier to deal with than large batteries, which are phenomenally heavy, being made of lead. Modern ones aren't even that loud.
  4. Guerillanon Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    So this goes from, "Keep this on the IRC and off the web" to 17 page thread.

    Thanks guys. Ruin the element of surprise.
  5. Re: Operation: Nightlight

    love it love it loveeee it :D must do this!
  6. Guerillanon Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight




    You dont understand what a detriment to the overall project this thread is.
  7. Theta Omega Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    They watch IRC, you know.
  8. unidentified Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    @Guerillanon - get over it. For them to inform the police they'd have to know that it was happening at the time - which means patrolling the whole of London for light emissions - never going to happen. I'd also love to know what law you think we could possibly be breaking by doing this.

    I'm a UK legalanon (for want of a better description, which I'm sure you can understand I'd prefer not to give) and I can't think of any law it could break. Remember the police can only get involved if it's a criminal act so that narrows down things quite a bit.
  9. Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Uhh, no actually, it was mine - but that's not how we work here at Anonymous... so GTFO troll
  10. Guerillanon Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Sorry I know I look like a crazy person. I was having a bad night. But the fact that we had the exact same idea... down to the operation name. The EXACT same operation name. Clearwater/Orlando anon have been working on this for over a month. It freaked me out.

    I haven't read the whole thread but I'll post up the specs for how to do this correctly. From what I can see at a glance you're close but there is a RIGHT way and a WRONG way to do this technically.

    I just wanted this to be a surprise both for the scinos here in clearwater AND for anon. To help recharge the batteries. But its okay. We'll still pull this off and we've got plenty of other ideas.

    In London you should look up a guy named Theodore Watson. He's already got the software, experience, and i believe he has his own mobile broadcast unit.

    Again sorry, and i'll update this thread later with the mobil broadcast unit specs and the software links for generative graffiti and laser tag.

    EDIT: I see wait what has already put up the MBU specs. Thats how its done. Take note.
  11. anonymous612 Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    It's not quite the same thing as the CW/Orlando one. Parallel evolution, though. And I did have a "WTFOMG" moment when CW/Orlando mentioned it.
  12. Re: Operation: Nightlight

    If there was every any doubt that anonymous is hive-mind, this will have banished it forever.
  13. Re: Operation: Nightlight

    It would be epic if we could project the image/date on the Batman building. How ironic would that be?

    For those who have never been to Nashville, the city has a building that is known as the Batman building, and for those who care, in the very first Matrix movie when Trinity is running away from the agents across the rooftops, the city skyline that you see is indeed Nashville.
  14. anonymous612 Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    (/productive comment)
  15. [Achil] Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    As I said in the Wirah, I love this idea. HOWEVER, we should only do it on a worthwhile place, as I also said in the Wirah, like parliament. If we're just going to project on some random building I don't see a point.

    Only thing with parliament is I'm wondering if it'd be legal to project something on them.

    I really want to see it when it comes on, only thing is day after it I have an exam in the morning. Curse you education. I'll probably still go when all arrangement details are made though.
  16. Anonnumition Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Doing it on Parliament has already been discussed in this thread, as far as I'm aware (lurkerlol) there was major difficulty as to where it could be projected FROM, and that Parliament is all lit up at night, so while it's dark, so, while you'd have the best (only) times to do it.

    So that idea was out before considering any further....
  17. Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Seems to me this has the potential to disrupt air traffic. Does the FAA have a say about such things?
  18. Re: Operation: Nightlight

    I wondered that - but most air traffic doesn't fly directly above London since 9/11 anyway. Some does though, so yes, we should look into it
  19. Theta Omega Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    You're not allowed to point powerful (ie., above class II) lasers into the sky without following a safety protocol (it's quite involved, and depends how far you are from the nearest airport). On the other hand, they have to find you, which is difficult. Lasers are regulated by the FDA in the USA, for some odd reason.

    There are, as far as I can tell, no restrictions on other light sources, at least in the USA, regardless of how powerful they are. Of course, if you cause a plane crash, you'll go to jail for a long, long time.

    The government body in the UK that regulates civil aviation is the CAA, the Civil Aviation Authority. They're pretty much the same as the FAA, but the rules are a little different.
  20. anon9000+ Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    If you're not moving it about why not hire a simple petrol-generator-with-wheels?
  21. Merkaba Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Dudes. What about LED throwies? Not as an alternative, since this plan seems to be rolling along, but in addition to the projector. A lot cheaper, and potentially just as effective. Also, very lulzy. Imagine a roving band of anons running around throwing magnets with LEDs on 'em at everything in sight, or plastering words in hard to reach places with ninja skillz. Urban information warfare, man.
  22. SciFITOlogy Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    LED throwies are more of a joke then a protest, they also tend to piss authorities off somewhat. You'd end up looking like a band of costumed kids out doing pranks. No message, it might be fun but the image branding isn't good.
  23. Re: Operation: Nightlight


    Get a message made from throwies up somewhere on day. Take pics so it definitely happened. Remove them next day.

    Rinse and repeat.
  24. Guerillanon Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    For those suggesting throwies... Please google the Boston Mooninite Scare.

    Throwies are no longer a good idea, ESPECIALLY not with a bomb threat crazy cult.
  25. anon2487 Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Cool, I'm really glad this idea's been picked up on. I've not read the thread because it's a bit TL:DR, but I couldn't see the following elements in the OP.

    If this is done in the States, a major Scilon landmark would be good.

    I'd hoped, it would be possible to do a projection onto Big Ben for the UK, signing off with the message "We have cake, they have lies..." and whatever else seemed appropriate (Date of protest, logo, etc. at the top).

    Contrary to what you might think, there aren't any legal problems with doing it on Big Ben, and in fact Front magazine did exactly this a few years ago, which is what gave me the original idea. AnonTipster, I know that you're used to dealing with the media, so it would be worth contacting Front to check what kit they used (they might also be interested in covering the /r/aid start to finish).

    In addition, ensure you capture exciting footage of everyone sneaking out of their houses at night, Doing the raid. Then "escaping". Making this something the media will really want to broadcast is the key to this Op's success. For this reason, making good preparation to get good footage out to the media as soon as it's happened, is incredibly important.

    Wanted to throw these in now, because I think they were elements that made the original idea strong.

    TL: DR
    (1) Project onto Big Ben - it's been done before with no probs, and it's not illegal.

    (2) If people like it: "We have cake, they have lies...", "May 10th, everywhere" and a small mask drawn up by a graphic anon, were the elements I'd originally thought would work well. Can you list the qualities the spotlight you're using will need the graphic to possess for it to work as a "filter"/cut out shape; that way people can submit and pick out the best design on enturb.

    (3) Contact Front to check what that they used (my initial research suggested it'd cost more like £500 for the right kit (but I may have been wrong).

    (4) Ensure you get exciting video - start: "creeping out of the house at night", to finish: "escape" - and make as much editing/media/interbuttz preparation as possible so that you can get the footage and the story out to the media as fast and effectively as possible.

    Good luck guys. :grin:
  26. unidentified Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    It's been done before as part of a business venture. That means that
    a)they didn't have to get a protest permit (its very much in the middle of the SOCA zone)
    b)I'm not 100% on what St Thomas' Hospital owns and what it doesn't, but they probably got permission off of them/paid them to project from their property (it's the other side of the river from big ben).

    We'd have to do both a and b, which will be hassle - not to mention the fact that not many people mill around big ben at night so exposure will be low.
  27. anon2487 Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    The exposure doesn't come from the people there, it comes from getting good media.

    Doing it where 500 people might see it is far less useful than having an exciting raid broadcast and printed in various places so that 10's or 100's of thousands of people see it.

    The whole key to the idea's success is media-interest and it's that part that requires careful execution and planning.

    As far as the police. As I said, Front magazine did exactly the same thing.

    If the exact date is broadcast all over enturb, then clearly the police might try and disrupt it. But as long as the final details are kept discreet, they're not going to waste too much time trying to stop a mischievous, but entirely legal media stunt from going down.
  28. unidentified Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    I'm not sure you understood my police point. They didn't have to ask the police, we do due to the protest nature of our endeavours. It will NOT be legal without permission. There are police around that area pretty constantly so they will know the second we start. Anyone doing it for protest reasons without a SOCPA permit WILL get arrested.

    There are plenty of other landmarks in London that don't cause the huge SOCPA headache, that get more footfall and that are just as well known and will be just as interesting to the press.
  29. anon2487 Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    ^^^ Like I said, I may be wrong. But please could you explain specifically which part of the legislation makes this idea illegal.
  30. unidentified Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    s132 Serious Organised Crime and Police Act 2005
  31. Theta Omega Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Doesn't have any language about projection of light. You need to get permission to demonstrate there, but if you do, you're perfectly within your rights to project anywhere you want to.
  32. unidentified Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    I know that. Projection of light for the purpose of promoting our cause IS demonstrating. Demonstrating, as I've been saying requires a permit or you'll get arrested. Getting a permit is hassle when we could choose another place where we don't need a permit.
  33. anon2487 Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    ^^^There are 2 problems with this though:

    (1) What is the current precedent definition of a "demonstration", 'cos I'm doubtful this would meet the current legal criteria.

    (2) However in the event that it did, we can make sure that it doesn't fall foul of this particular act as follows:

    All we'd need to do, is to recce, calculate and confirm the technical aspects in advance. Have 4/5 people meet up, put the kit together, and drive the first part of the journey. Just before moving into the SOCPA designated area the vehicle would pull over, all of the people save for 1 would jump out, wait in a nightcafe to co-ordinate things with people waiting to edit the footage blitz the intertubes and media. Just one person would take the vehicle the last short distance, carry out the projection, capture it on video. Then "escape" back to the crew.

    This would add excitement to the whole deal, and would make it more, not less interesting for the press, Many people are already against the section of the SOCPA legislation that covers demonstrations in the vicinity of parliament, and it would give yet another angle to the story that would help it get bigger write ups.

    TL: DR
    Projecting onto Big Ben would be awesome, is 100% practical, legally and technically (and as I said above, reading about Front magazine doing exactly the same a while back is what made me suggest the idea in the first place.)
  34. XenuLovesU Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    If you're just projecting light onto a building using a normal light source like a DLP projector, it's not going to be an issue. Sure, a 900 watt projector is bright, but it's not a hazard to air navigation.

    If you're going to be using lasers at all (at least in the US) of an output of more than 5 miliwatts per square centimeter, you need to request a variance from the Food and Drug Administration’s Center for Devices and Radiological Health (CDRH), and notify the FAA to see if they have any objections:

    FAA - Airspace and Rules

  35. unidentified Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    It is an undefinable word (as decided in R (on the application of Singh and another) v Chief Constable of West Midlands Police - [2007] 2 All ER 297 ) but this really isn't the point. You're not about to get in to legal submissions with police officers. You WILL be arrested.

    I've always said you can apply for a SOCA permit. I've also always said that applying for one is a real pain that we don't need if we choose a different location. Lots of other locations have been suggested in this thread, I'm not sure what your attachment to parliament's clocktower (technically it's impossible to project on to big ben (as it's a bell)).

    So roughly a mile away in a rough area of London (Elephant and Castle) with obviously expensive looking kit (not to mention heavy)...

    Have you BEEN anywhere near here? The only nightcafe's in that area are not the type you want to hang around in.

    You do realise there's nowhere to park - where you'd project from isn't on a road, it's outside the middle of a hospital (which pretty much has no parking).

    In one of the most heavily CCTV'd areas of the world...

    Personally I don't find getting arrested 'exciting'

    You can only project on to parliament if you
    a)get a SOCA permit which is annoying, requires someone to namefag themselves and will require the date and time to be known well in advance
    b)get permission off of St Thomas' Hospital (or a hire a boat).

    Projecting on to most other London landmarks will require neither of these.
  36. Theta Omega Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Projecting onto MI5 is always fun, and won't get you arrested. It's also SPECTACULARLY visible for miles up and down the Thames.
  37. Re: Operation: Nightlight

    Do you mean the green building at Vauxhall? That's MI6 (okay, SIS really...) but same difference and brilliant for the PR.

    MI5 are across the river at Millbank, by Lambeth bridge, but the building is far less distinctive and not really as recognisable as SIS headquarters.

    It's a good idea. Do it. Although, not lasers. They could be taken for missile targeting and we'd be in deep shit then.
  38. anon2487 Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    The police are only going to arrest you if they believe that you're doing something arrestable. Given that this is a public website, we (and they) will be very aware if this meets the criteria in advance. I'm saying we can carry it out in a way that doesn't fall foul of SOCPA or any other legislation. If this isn't a demonstration in the legal sense of the word, it doesn't fall under the act.

    My second point, I'm not sure about, but by using only one person to carry out the last bit, and not having that person involved in the original planning, it looks as though it'll side-step the act as well due to the way Section 133 paragraoh 3 is written, but I'm not 100% on this bit, so it'd need confirming with a proper real life lawyer.

    Get real. I'm talking generally, not specifically. As it goes there is somewhere very specific that I had in mind, but shouting certain details tends not to be too smart.

    There actually is a way to project onto Big Ben, this is one of the things I specifically looked into. I'm a tad irritated that AnonTipster didn't bother to ask me whether I'd already spent much time finding things out or had in fact started organising before he decided that a "A cunning and most epic plan" had just occurred to him. I'm not bothered about the idea being nicked, but I could have done without having made a pointless trip to London and some other arrangements that took up time.

    Neither do I, everything I've been involved with has been 100% kosher, and wherever possible I've tried to push people suggesting things that wouldn't have been, towards things that actually are. However creative mischief does not = illegal, and everything I've read points to this being possible to carry out in a way that doesn't fall foul of any laws. If people definitely decide not to do Big Ben, it'd at least make sense to contact the police and check whether shining a non-commercial logo on a building in a SOCPA designated area, would constitute a demonstration.

    Two words: media interest.
    Having said that, if we've got no choice, then finding the next best alternative media-wise will have to be done. I'm not overly hung up on anything, other than generating decent and amusing press coverage. As for whether there've been good alternatives suggested, I've not read the thread so I don't know, (I only found out about the thread today).
  39. unidentified Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    There is no criteria as to whether something is a protest, it's decided on a case by case basis as I said in my last post. Imagine the scene, you're projecting and a policeman walks up:
    'what are you doing'
    'so what's that logo of'
    'oh they're a protest group'

    I've already said there isn't a proper legal meaning to the word 'protest'. It's far too late at night for me to go looking in halsbury's, but I'm pretty sure the case I referred to is the latest word on it.

    You've misunderstood it. What that section's is saying is that if there's more than one person protesting then a representative must file for the permit, if there's only one person protesting then it needs to be that person themselves.


    I'll also double check it with a criminal law barrister at some point during the weekend if it'll make you happy.

    Unless you plan to be on the bridge at an angle I really can't see how there could be (you're aware that everything up to the river on the left hand side of the bridge (looking towards parliament) is owned by St Thomas' right up 'till past parliament?)

    You're the second person in this thread to have claimed to have had the idea nicked from them. I think everyone just came up with it at the same time.

    If you ask it that way they'll say no it doesn't. If you tell them that the image is the logo for an anti-Scientology protest group then their answer will be different.

    Read from about page 6 onwards - we came up with a load of ideas from including the Tate Modern:
  40. anon2487 Member

    Re: Operation: Nightlight

    "Nicked" as in been talking about it with various people, then posted a reference to it on enturb earlier the same day this thread turns out to have been started. Nothing wrong with politely asking what plans have already been made, especially as I'd specifically gone to London to check it out, and 3 of us had spent quite a bit of time examining projector options, prices and practicalities.

    As long as it's done well and in a way that captures the media's attention it's all good, but honesty and politeness are nice too.

    As far as the legal points go. I agree that I'm almost definitely wrong in my understanding of Section 133 paragraoh 3; but if you're able to easily get counsel to have a look at the protest/demonstration issue, that would be really useful to have posted to this thread. Any doubts the police might have, would then be somewhat assuaged. If we are all good on, would you be able to ask whether they'd foresee any other legal difficulties?

    Cheers dude.

    PS nice picture!!!:grin:

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