Rafsanjani Sermon: Discussion and Aftermath

Discussion in 'News And Current Events' started by Unregistered, Jul 15, 2009.

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  1. This is really very superficial. I won't bother to discuss this.
  2. ella Member

    You found that superficial? You wanted an article? Sorry, don't have time for that.. :It is Iranian forum. :D
  3. a superficial thinking, I don't need you to write an article or a book. I don't have time to read that too :D
  4. hay you guise. seriously. take the Hezbollah/Israel shit to another thread pls.
  5. Visionary Member

    Exactly! This is not the place to discuss Israel and Hezbollah.
    This site is about Iran and this forum is for current news.
    This thread is for discussion and posting of news about the Rafsanjani speech and the protesting afterward and what it could mean in the future.

    Random discussions of Israel, Lebanon, and Palestine, not related to Friday's events, do not belong here.

    AND I will not reply to questions about them...especially not by a troll who will just keep distracting with new complaints each time.

    Now...does anyone have any videos from Friday night? ;)
    Nightowl said people protested until midnight and I'm curious to see what the protests were like by nighttime.
  6. Just remind me who started hating on Hezbollah and wanted the Iranians to hate them.

  7. LOL. so "down with this sort of thing" translates to "death to this sort of thing"?
  8. atmasabr Member

    No, I don't agree with that. I think many of the religious leaders in Iran, Rafsanjani among them, really are trying to reconcile the curent theocratic government with the best interests of the Iranian people.

    Also, consider that in Iraq, which is not a theocracy, the most powerful person right now is not President Karzai, it's Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani. For a long while it was between him and al-Sadr. Of course, the Shiite religious establishment and their loyalists are only the most powerful of several diverse political players in that country.

    The thing that threatens the power of the religious leaders the most is not a change in government, it's a loss of legitimacy in the eyes of the people [which itself could lead to a change in government.]

    To put it another way, we've seen the credibility of the Catholic Church in the United States plummet in the last decade due to the pedophile priest scandal, and for a long time before that I think their political influence was decreasing anyway. I don't think it was because of any changes in the law.
  9. atmasabr Member

    Why not? We already have a Mu---uh I mean a President who wasn't even born in the United States. But it is half-true. Our Senators pointed out over the last week that we ask stupid religion questions of just about every first non-Protestant person about to come to power.

    I just feel the need to say that it's the people in the US who are predominantly Christian, and our culture is reflected in the style in which our government functions. It's not our government that's Christian, just its symbolism. We print "In God We Trust" on our money, just as people of different religions stick out in their neighborhoods. But we're all Americans.

    By the way, I have major problems with Wicca that would lead me to ask stupid religion questions of any Wiccan politician.
  10. Ray Murphy Member

    [Ray]: All you need is what Mousavi and Rafsanjani and others have virtually guaranteed - a new (fair) election and the freedom to resume peaceful protesting about anything at all, so that things can be gradually changed to suit the majority. That can still be done with a Muslim "backbone" if the people want it.

    For example, I'm sure that the Australian and American people would not allow a "Satanist" or "Witchcraft" political party to get a chance to hold power because it goes against the Christian style of government we still have, so I wouldn't think it was unfair if the Iranian people barred any other religious group from attaining supreme power. It's their country after all - and religion is a big part of the culture.

    Obama has certification from the registrar of births in Hawaii that says he was born there after Hawaii became a U.S. state. The Senate also has an official FULL-version "certification of live birth" that was issued in the 1960's.

    The questions about religion are not as stupid or prejudiced as they may seem, because they indirectly refer to the culture that a politician prefers or supports - and in Obama's case it happens to be a culture and set of beliefs that is superior to anything the U.S. has seen for many years - if ever. It's a set of beliefs that align with the literal meaning of the "All men are created equal" spiel - which has been a farce until Obama came along.

    Yes - all WHITE, Christian-sounding MEN with lots of money or influence, but Obama and millions of thinking Americans changed all that.

    There are still Christian principles at play a lot of the time, and the God the U.S.people trust is the same God that Abraham trusted and the Muslims and Jews trust.

    And so you should.
  11. raf no matter how you twist him will still be a product of the system.. I do think he is considering the will of the people more than the current leaders though..
    but some change is better than no change..
  12. I am curious about this. Not challenging it. Please explain why you believe that some change is better than no change in the context of Iran. Thank you. :)
  13. Visionary Member

    Well I should hope not.
    I think Afghanistan is more than enough for him to deal with right now.


    On a side note: Does anyone have any more news from yesterday? lol
  14. jadt65 Member

    or anything from today?
  15. One thing you "should" know: every bit moving on earth is seen by Allah.

    Truth of the matter is that God did not make this world my/your ego did
    if God worked on the level of form(this imaginary world made buy or egos)
    he would be endorsing /validating the "realness " of this dream made up by hundreds of split fragement of a mind that was once wholly joined with God.

    Being supported with weapons, is only because Allah" caused this to happen". And btw, during the Hezbollah-Israel war in 2006, it was really more than just weapons that made Hezbollah win. If you make a comparison, you would say Israel would erase Hezbollah. But Allah's miracles and his determined believers and well organized can change all that.

    Allahs miracles have nothing to do with winning wars or anything for that matter on the level of form(this world)-
    Allah works on the level of mind(not form) he will help you change your mind about the way you see things -this is the miracle -to see things with real vision as apposed to ego run vision.
    to insinuate that God made this material world of form would imply that God/Allah/Ahura/etc is a psychopath.
    What loving intelligence would create a world where bodies attack each other,where bodies disintegrate to dust with old age and illness- where separation is perceived as the real world.This world of form seem much more in line with the egos (self will without God run riot)
    Most religious systems are way way off the mark, in that they all subscribe to the theory that this World is substantial and real-this body these feelings -these people etc etc..
    how do you find your way out? By asking god to change your perception of what you thought of as "real" then comes practice of forgiveness-forgiving yourself and"others appearing "out there" - In God Eyes there never was /is NO SEPARATION -so to perceive that things "OUT THERE" are jigging you about and attacking you is unreal..(of course very real to the ego and this ego made world...
    we all fell for it hook line and sinker

    I will not experience /find peace/truth Until I can forgive myself and others without exception /reservation.
  16. Could you prove this plz
  17. do they even exist?
  18. why hai there, some atheists would like to have a word with you :)

    yea, proof plz, tits or GTFO
  19. <<<<<<<<<Could you prove this plz >>>>>>>
    I can prove you have a brain but can you prove I have a mind-what does it look like,how much does it weigh-what clor is it?

    I dont have anything to prove-truth does not "need" to be defended
    ask God to show You the truth with all you heart-and You will indeed be shown
    be prepared for a shock!!!(to the egos position that is!)
    God bless all of us here and ther known or unknown
    I wish you well as I wish myself well
    I choose the Joy and peace of God instead of pain and attack.

    show me how to see the real world with Your vision not my egos.
    Show me how to give love ,for to give love is to receive love .

    ~No more no less....
  20. i don't think you wanna see Allah's tits.
  21. Ray Murphy Member

    He hasn't been pretending to be anything else.
  22. Ray Murphy Member

    Under the law of averages they would exist in nearly all spheres of life. They are usually ordinary people with some different beliefs (or knowledge) about a bunch of things.
  23. JohnDoe Moderator

  24. I would love to, but only if you are willing to listen and research thereafter. I can't explain everything to you here and by typing.

    Since you asked for a proof means that there is something inside you that wants to know. But don't be negative and having a prior denial that you showed in your second phrase.

    Throughout history, from the first prophet, Adam, till now, Allah's showed to people his presence by showing them miracles and prophecies. In our time, the biggest miracle and forever lasting that no one can reasonably deny is the Koran. So it would look reasonable for me to talk about the Koran and prove that its words are for someone who has total perfection, that just defines the one and only god, Allah.

    I wouldn't be able to give a better explanation than this:
    Authenticity of the Quran

    please read and advance with chapters.

    If you want to know more, make researches, talk with religious Muslims, preferable Shiites. Not just anyone, they should be able to answer your questions.

    Oh, and if you have a prior negative feelings about Islam, discover first what really Islam is. by the Ahlul Bayt DILP - Discover Islam

    Good Luck ;)
  25. FreedomAgent Member

  26. I always laugh, when atheists cry that they are picked on by religious people, and then they turn around and do exactly to religious people what they are claiming is done to them.

    Tolerance means both atheists and non-atheists need to learn to get along and leave each other alone. Both can think whatever they want, as long as they do not attack others because of what they think.
  27. FreedomAgent Member

    I guess you didn't watch the video, because it does not attack anyone, the actual message is to get along you moron
  28. User identified.

    Classification: Deacon

    &quot;Be he a Baptist, Scientologist or Zoroastrian, in the heat of battle Deacon will call down Divine retribution on all net sinners, and will never miss an opportunity to blather endlessly about his religion. Deacon is fervent and earnest, but seldom contributes anything of interest or substance to the discussion. Occasionally Tireless Rebutter or Philosopher will rouse themselves engage Deacon in battle, but they soon lose interest because of his utter predictability.&quot;

    Sauce: Deacon

    The biggest miracle is that we are alive. That's it. Fuck the Koran, and fuck the Bible too. Also, Xenu. :D

    Back on topic: anyone got info on what happened when the crowds tried to take over the media buildings or whatever?
  29. I, the poster of the response to the Atheist, didn't respond to your video post. It is distracting from the actual point. The Atheist guy asked for a proof, it is of my religious duty to respond to that request.

    Your message, "Get Along" is pointless. If you are an Atheist too, and seem to be unwilling to change your mind, you! get along. That guy asked for a proof, and again of my duty is to respond.
  30. You are alive, who created you? :)
    A big truth, you will die, where will you reside ? :)

    If we are right, we reside in heaven, you reside in hell.
    If you are right, we both no longer exist.
    So, what is the smarter choice? ;)
  31. No, I did not watch the video, and you jump to conclusions when you assume I was talking about the video or even about you. Excuse me, but who is the moron?
  32. FreedomAgent Member

    message of getting along is pointless? ok
    and I do not want to change my mind? ok

    should we not get along? and should we change our mind because you said so? you starting to sound like the religious regime that has enslaved my people for 30 years ... so I say hope you change your mind and decide to get along with people who don't share your believes, that is the only way to save lives, but knowing your kind you'll put a sword on people and will convert by force and one day the sword will turn on you and your loved ones

    I am afraid thats the cycle proven time and time again
  33. FreedomAgent Member

    when you reply to someone by quoting their post that means you are speaking to that person you noob, so who is the moron?
  34. hes a religionfag, forget him man, he'll just spout maor Koran gobshite

    this is why we cant have nice things
  35. nonsense

    sheeeesh!!! I can see all the Mullahs ,fags etc falling overthemselves at all the bickering here on this thread--
    you all set yourselves up-----(well not all, u guys know who u are;) )

    hmmm aint it time we forgave our childish differnces -forgive each other and grow up

    I am tired of pikkin up broken rattles of the forum floor!!!

    be well one and all
    God or Good bless
  36. It was because I was agreeing with you, moron. A little defensive? I take that to mean maybe it applied to you, too, or at least you feel it did. Guilty conscience?

  37. What are you talking about? Do not mix up things.
    Islam is independednt of any authority in the world.
    If a Muslim killed someone with no right to do so, then he is the one to blame, not Islam. And so for other religions or people.
    If you think that the opposition are Atheists or want to change the identity of Islamic Iran, then you are in total delusion.

  38. loser, follow your devil taking you to hell.
  39. FreedomAgent Member

    I was talking about religious people killing in the name or religion

    short term an Islamic Iran is what it is, long term there should be a separation, only than Iran will be democratic and free
  40. JohnDoe Moderator

    Can't believe in this thread has gone from the very important discussion about the speech, to this petty argument between 'my religion is better than your religion, or no religion'.

    Get real! What has all of this got to do with Iran? Nothing. So please go and have your debate somewhere else.

    Thank you
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