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Scientologists buy chunk of Clearwater's 'super block' dream

Discussion in 'News and Current Events' started by Anonymous, Sep 25, 2013.

  1. Anonymous Member

    http://www.tampabay.com/news/growth...unk-of-clearwaters-super-block-dream/2143942#

    4stb_church092613_11604690_8col.jpg
    The Church of Scientology has purchased two parcels in a high-visibility block in downtown Clearwater that includes a five-story office building at 121 N Osceola Ave. The building has been vacant for the last five years and is bordered on both sides by parking lots.

    Excerpt:


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  2. Anonymous Member

    ^ (Sorry, my bad. Mod, please nuke the above fail post if possible.)
    They overpaid on a $600,000 property by $.2.4 million?? So much for the theory they're running out of money.
  3. blownforgood Member

    Welcome to the new RTC Florida!
    Dave Miscavige constantly threatened to buy a small office building in Clearwater so he could escape the nonstop sabotage of Int Base staff.

    His current offices in Clearwater are as crappy as they come.
    His palacial offices in the Sooper Power Building are probably now out of date since they were designed in 2004...It also puts him real close to the public and exposes him to have to hear about all their "imagined problems about not having any more money to give him."

    I'd put money on a new Gold or RTC office.
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  4. Anonymous Member

    The land value is usually a minor portion of the total market value of the land + buildings.
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  5. DeathHamster Member

    And they'll keep elderly retired unicorns there too!

    It could happen...
    • Like Like x 2
  6. Budd Member

    Can someone please show us on the regular YOU-ARE-HERE map where this super-block is? Thank you.
  7. Anonymous Member

    OK, I'm definitely not a realtor so I may be wrong, but I believe the Pinellas County property appraiser value does give the value of the land + buildings.

    Regardless, the cult spending more than $3 million for yet another building and prime real estate - and possibly overpaying by a shit ton - is not good news. I was hoping there was truth to all the recent postings about their money drying up. This is the exact opposite. Fucking bastards.
  8. DeathHamster Member

    http://goo.gl/maps/xMdh5
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  9. Anonymous Member


    It might be good news. Might be trying to launder questionable money into real estate, or he could be trying to set up a loss on paper to prevent/thwart lawsuits, tax liens.

    Accounting is a strange world filled with archaic, medieval rules and concepts. I need to review the tax code again and see what the irs says about buildings. Did they mortgage the buildings, or did they pay cash? One of the noticeable trends with frauds is that they tend to spend a lot of money on capitol towards the end.
    This is done to give the appearance of growth, as well as have an asset to sale off and make more money off of in the end. It also gives a very convenient excuse as to were some of the money disappeared to.

    From what i have seen here and at other sites, CO$ pays cash for a building, then mortgages the building again to do God only knows what with the money. One big advantage to a mortgage property is the lien the bank puts on it. It keeps the property from being taken by any one other then the bank.

    but rampant speculation is just rampant speculation without dox.
    • Like Like x 2
  10. Anonymous Member

    Paging Amx...
  11. blownforgood Member

    The building next door is the WB. It has been where Dave Miscavige's offices have been since the 1990's. He has the top floor.
    This new building will be for him and his staff. It won't be used for public or riffraff staff. He needs a place close but out of the way of running into people.
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  12. Lee Arnold Jr., CEO of Colliers International, and his father-in-law Herbert G. Brown sold two parcels on the north end of the "super block" to the church this week for more than $3 million. The Pinellas County property appraiser assigned a market value of just under $610,000 to the land, which totals about an acre.
    The church already owned a three-story building on the block, at 118 N Fort Harrison Ave.
    The property the church bought this week has seen better days. An aging five-story office building at 121 N Osceola Ave., vacant for the last five years and once used for a temporary library while the city built its signature Main Library across the street, is bordered on both sides by forlorn parking lots.
    The sale also includes another parking lot on the corner of Drew Street and Fort Harrison Avenue.
    The sale to the church was unexpected news to aquarium leaders and downtown aquarium supporters.
    "I was surprised that they bought it. And that they bought it at that price. That's a premium," said Frank Dame, the aquarium's chief operating officer.
    Mayor George Cretekos hasn't closed the door on the latest chapter of the "super block" dream: a city parking garage for aquarium and other downtown visitors.
    "Whether this takes it off the table? That's up to the church."
    http://www.tampabay.com/news/growth...hunk-of-clearwaters-super-block-dream/2143942
  13. Bubbles Member

    Tax assessor page for 121 N. Osceola Ave, Clearwater, Fl (Pinellas County):

    http://www.pcpao.org/?pg=http://www.pcpao.org/general.php?pn=152916000001200400

    OwnerARNOLD BROWN PROPERTIES
    C/O COLLIERS ARNOLD
    311 PARK PLACE BLVD STE 600
    CLEARWATER, FL 33759-4925Situs121 N OSCEOLA AVE
    CLEARWATER
    Account number
    R170920
    Parcel Number
    16/29/15/00000/120/0400
    Millage code
    CWD - CLWTR DOWNTOWN
    Millage rate
    22.4445
    Assessed value
    415,000
    School assessed value
    415,000

    2012 annual bill

    Ad valorem
    $9,314.48
    Non-ad valorem
    $0.00
    Total tax
    Paid 2012-11-15 $8,941.90
    Receipt #756-12-013924
    Legal description

    FROM INTERSECTION OF S R/W DREW ST & E R/W OF NO OSCEOLA AVE TH S 90FT FOR POB TH E 150 FT TH S 60FT TH W 150FT TH N 60FT TO POB AND THAT PT DESC AS FR OM INTERSECTION OF S R/W DREW ST & E R/W OF N OSCEOLA AVE TH S 168FT FOR POB TH E 150FT TH S 65FT TH W 150FT TH N 65FT TO POB
    2013 Preliminary Value Information
    Year Save-Our-Homes cap Just/Market Value Assessed Value/ SOH Cap County Taxable Value School Taxable Value Municipal Taxable Value
    2013 No $350,000 $350,000 $350,000 $350,000 $350,000

    Quality: Average
    NoDrawing.gif

    Square Footage: 21511.00
    Foundation: Spread/Mono Footing
    Floor System: Slab On Grade
    Exterior Wall: Concrete Blk/Stucco
    Roof Frame: Reinforced Concrete
    Roof Cover: Built Up/Composition
    Stories: 5
    Living units: 0
    Floor Finish: Carpet Combination
    Interior Finish: Plaster Ed Direct
    Fixtures: 38
    Year Built: 1958
    Effective Age: 34
    Cooling: Heat & Cooling Pkg
    Other Depreciation: 50%





    And second piece(vacant land):

    OwnerARNOLD BROWN PROPERTIES
    C/O COLLIERS ARNOLD
    311 PARK PLACE BLVD STE 600
    CLEARWATER, FL 33759-4925SitusN FT HARRISON AVE
    CLEARWATER
    Account number
    R170921
    Parcel Number
    16/29/15/00000/120/0600
    Millage code
    CWD - CLWTR DOWNTOWN
    Millage rate
    22.4445
    Assessed value
    259,526
    School assessed value
    259,526
    2012 annual bill

    Ad valorem
    $5,824.93
    Non-ad valorem
    $0.00
    Ownership/Mailing AddressSite Address
    ARNOLD BROWN PROPERTIES
    C/O COLLIERS ARNOLD
    311 PARK PLACE BLVD STE 600
    CLEARWATER FL 33759-4925 0 N FT HARRISON AVE CLEARWATER 33755- Green100.gif
    Property Use: 1000 (Vacant Commercial Land - lot & acreage) Living Units:
    [click here to hide] 2013 Legal Description
    BEG AT INTERSECTION OF S R/W OF DREW ST & W R/W OF N FORT HARRISON AVE TH S 60FT TH W 345FT TH N 60FT TH E 345FT TO POB
    2013 Exemptions efile2.png File for Homestead Exemption
    2013 Parcel Use
    Homestead: No Government: No
    Institutional: No Historic: No
    Homestead Use Percentage: 0.00%
    Non-Homestead Use Percentage: 100.00% Classified Agricultural: No
    2013 Parcel Information 2013 Trim Notice
    Most Recent RecordingSales Comparison
    Census Tract
    Evacuation Zone
    (NOT the same as a FEMA Flood Zone)

    Plat Book/Page
    13370/2184 adobe.jpg

    12103025900
    NON EVAC
    2013 Preliminary Value Information
    Year Save-Our-Homes cap Just/Market Value Assessed Value/ SOH Cap County Taxable Value School Taxable Value Municipal Taxable Value
    2013 No $259,526 $259,526 $259,526 $259,526 $259,526

    http://www.pcpao.org/?pg=http://www.pcpao.org/general.php?pn=152916000001200600




















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  14. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Resistance is futile. All of Clearwater will be assimilated. Then the name will be changed to Hubbardville.
    • Like Like x 5
  15. Everyone needs to bookmark Davy's new hideout on google maps. After all, we don't want him to feel forgotten. He's so special. Be sure to honk/wave every time you drive by just to say hello.

    [IMG]

    [IMG]
  16. Anonymous Member

    BFG, respect you man but this seems like a whole lot of speculation on the place becoming Davey's offices. The article already mentions "rumors" of it becoming staff housing or a retirement home for elderly scilons - with no dox to support either. Got any dox on it becoming RTC east instead?

    Yeah, good idea. Because lots of honking/waving at a dilapidated, vacant building will make a big point.
    /sarcasm
    • Like Like x 2
  17. whitesand Member

    This building is across from the CW library. As seen in the picture, scientologists walk past it now already. It's close to the Sandcastle area, and I think those are already the finance offices of the church. If it does become DM's offices, he stays close to the money machine.
    • Like Like x 3
  18. Anonymous Member

    AFAIK, the Sandcastle is not the finance office. It's where they have their higher level services which is why scilons walk by it.

    And the entirety of Clearwater itself is the money machine. So if we want to speculate where DM would put his offices, it could be the Ft. Harrison penthouse, the Sandcastle, the new Super Power building - hell, anywhere he wants.

    Yes, the newly purchased property could be his offices. But to say it IS his offices is just more speculation without dox. The telltale sign of if this will be RTC east will be if we see some multi-million dollar renovations start up with gated, ultra-high security walls, cameras, sniper tower , etc. And that could take a year or more to get designed and underway. So until that starts happening, here's speculation in the other direction: it doesn't make sense that this was bought to be DM's offices.
  19. pooks Member

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  20. whitesand Member

    This is a quote from the Tampa Bay Times November 12, 2011, part of "The Money Machine" series. It is about Hy Levy, a long-term registrar.

    "He (Hy Levy) boarded a Scientology bus for the seven-minute ride to the Sandcastle building on the downtown waterfront. His ground-floor office opened to a patio next to a brook where he sometimes took parishioners to talk."
    • Like Like x 3
  21. RightOn Member

    "retirement home for elderly scilons"

    huh?
    if you can't work any longer you are offloaded, as far as I know
  22. Enturbuleak Member

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  23. Rod Keller Member

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  24. AnonoLily Member


    Marc, question for you...sorry if this has been asked before. Is Miscavige "living" or perhaps I should say "roosting" in the penthouse at the Osceola while he is in CW?
    • Like Like x 1
  25. amaX Member

    scinewproperty_zps3d808de9.png

    A= The newly purchased property.
    To help you get an idea of where this building is located I've pointed out other place.
    CCHR Florida (not really on the map, but right above where it says Jones St.)
    Sandcastle
    Osceola Inn
    Winter Wonderland parking lot
    Clearwater Library (directly across from the new property)
    Sea Org Alley (Watterson Ave.)
    Old Bank Building
    Coachman Building
    City Hall
    Pinellas Co. Transit Service Bus Terminal
    Oak Cove
    Ft. Harrison Hotel
    Super Power Building
    Clearwater Police Station Dist. 2
    Big tent area (not really on the map, but right below where it says Franklin St.)
    • Like Like x 5
  26. Anonymous Member

    I am not Marc, but I do know there is a Miscavige apartment at Hacienda Gardens and there's also a penthouse apartment at Oak Cove.
    • Like Like x 3
  27. Anonymous Member

    Just FYI - according to Mary McConnell on Ortega's blog, it is actually 3 properties they purchased in that deal, plus one other one just for good measure:

    • Like Like x 1
  28. amaX Member

    dammit.
    okay. i'll fix the map and make a larger map to show where the place on calumet is in conjunction with downtown. GARG.
    • Like Like x 2
  29. Anonymous Member

    Wait...SIX million? And for three properties?? If true, that's way more than a minor mistake by the Tampa Bay Times reporter. And also further kills the idea the cult is running out of money anytime soon. They're buying up all of downtown Clearwater fer Christ's sake!
    • Like Like x 1
  30. Rod Keller Member

  31. amaX Member

    newsciproperty22_zps5829fcff.png

    ^^^Newly purchased property at 2005 Calumet St. which is across the street from the property they already own at 2000 Calumet which is their laundry and a warehouse. New property shown in conjunction with the two main SO berthing properties Hacienda and Sherwood Gardens. Also noted are the Super Power Building and the newly purchased super block.
    • Like Like x 6
  32. Anonymous Member

    Sorry but if what Tony O is reporting on is true, Tom "I'm not an Indie but hang with them" DeVocht is a total fucking moron.

    Yes, it would have been completely and utterly lulzy if the Indies actually got the Arnold building smack dab in the middle of cultville. But is that what happened? NO. And not only no Indie org, but the cult now owns that building instead.

    And in Tony O's article, DeVocht also says, "That area [the Lee Arnold Building] was the city's last gasp for development down there. But it's done. It's over for Clearwater."

    So if I'm getting this all straight, this Indie "troll" has resulted in the cult buying Clearwater's last gasp for downtown development and it's over for Clearwater.

    Are. You. Fucking. Kidding. Me???!!!!

    Nice going you fucking Indie dickwads. What's your next great idea - to troll the cult into buying the Tampa Bay Times?

    AARGH!
    • Like Like x 1
  33. amaX Member

    scinewproperty2_zpsbae1d857.png

    New map showing adding 118 N. Ft. Harrison Ave. and also the three big red stars is the third property. The orange box shows the super block they've purchased.
    • Like Like x 4
  34. amaX Member

    I understand it's hard not getting the awesomeness of what the Indies have done, but it's actually a beautiful thing so don't be hating on Tom DeVocht.

    No one is buying property in downtown Clearwater unless it's the cult or someone stupid. Non-Sci businesses don't make it down there. So buildings sit forever.

    How do you make the cult to waste their money and buy property that's just sitting there when the cult doesn't need it? Say that the Indies are going to purchase a piece of property. \

    Nice troll, Mr. DeVocht and the Indies. Moar pls.
    • Like Like x 8
  35. Anonymous Member

    Sorry amaX but that doesn't make sense. So you're saying it's good that the cult buys up all of downtown Clearwater? Especially the prime parcel that's the last hope for development there? And in a buyer's market right as real estate is starting to show signs of turnaround?

    I don't see how we'll ever see the end of the cult if the "awesome strategy" is to drain their money by buying up all of downtown Clearwater. There was another thread where it was described how the cult owns billions in real estate around the world in separate corporations, cash reserves in the billions (from which they could be making hundreds of millions in interest) on top of their millionaire and billionaire whales to tap from.

    Minimally the real estate is equity and investment. It's stashed in hundreds of different corporations so no one person can run away with everything, not even DM. And even if they crashed and burned right this second, they could live off their holdings and investments for decades. I want to see the end of the cult sometime in the next few years. This puts it off to sometime - I don't know when.

    So please, if there's something else I'm not getting about this "awesomeness" let me know. Because otherwise this just sucks. Be back in a few after I down a few beers.
  36. tigeratbay Member

    Speaking of which, now i can no further access their articles unless I pay $5 per month according to the page that blocks me and I tried many times. That means I can no longer comment either. This came up on the previous article, but got through, now it is absolute, after 10 times from different links. I may call them. The page says something like 15 times allowed free, that's it. Could be because I no longer subscribe to the paper?
    • Like Like x 1
  37. DeathHamster Member

    The building was sitting empty for years. This way, the previous owner is off the hook, CoS spent some reserves, and they're going to have to justify their religious exemption from property taxes.

    In most places, you can't claim a property tax exemption if the building is vacant. (If it's not being used, then it's not being used for religious purposes. In yer face, as the lawyers would say.) Now they're going to have to stretch their dwindling staff to do something with it.
    • Like Like x 7
  38. Rod Keller Member

    They will probably buy Villa Del Mar next. They own the three other complexes on that street.
  39. anon walker Moderator

    Well, they can kiss THAT dream goodbye, unless the want to just install a monorail through the area and give cult tours.

    So, now that the redevelopment scheme is a bust, can CW residents sue for reparations since they paid several hundred thousand dollars to redesign the region to make it more visitor friendly? Because Scientology is the opposite of that thing and they're the only ones who benefited.
    • Like Like x 3

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