Scientology sued for Fraud! It's going DOWN like bird sh**! (The Garcia Suit)

Discussion in 'Media' started by BlackRob, Jan 23, 2013.

  1. Anonymous Member

    Ooops again. So many dox, so little freebie Pacer access that is limited to $15 per quarter. Additional Bob Johnson Declaration parts (over 200 pages) will likely be gotten a later date. But for now, my freebie limit is maxed out.
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  2. wolfbane Member

    IANAL, but it seems McCoun's ruling split things damn near down the middle with only a slight leaning towards favoring Team Garcia side.

    From: Garcia vs Scientology: McCoun's Order Regarding Subpoenas
    That report was this additional document:
    The short version of the six categories of issues detailed in the Pre-hearing Status Report (see email exhibit at the end):
    1. All written agreements, subsequent to January 1, 2007, relating to litigation against any
      Scientology affiliated entity, between everybody on Team Garcia (including Mike, Marty and lawyers and their personnel).
    2. All evidence of communications, including notes, affidavits, recordings, time records, emails
      and correspondence, subsequent to January1, 2007, relating to litigation against any
      Scientology affiliated entity, between everybody on Team Garcia (including same parties noted above). Furthermore, Bob Johnson agreed to cough up a privilege log for the Judge to review in-camera.
    3. All evidence of communications, including notes, affidavits, recordings, time records, emails
      and correspondence, subsequent to January1, 2007, relating to litigation against any
      Scientology affiliated entity, between Mike Rinder and everybody else on Team Garcia. Big fuss raised by Team Garcia about this stuff being "attorney work product."
    4. All evidence of communications, including notes, affidavits, recordings, time records, emails
      and correspondence, subsequent to January1, 2007, relating to litigation against any
      Scientology affiliated entity, between Marty Rathbun and everybody else on Team Garcia. Same big fuss raised on No. 3 applied here too.
    5. All communications, including written agreements, notes, affidavits, recordings, checks,
      emails, and correspondence, subsequent to January 1, 2007, relating to payment of
      compensation or remuneration of any kind to Mike Rinder, between everybody else on Team Garcia. Team Garcia stipulated that Mike Rinder received compensation for his services from the plaintiffs and readily offered to give up these dox without a fight.
    6. All communications, including written agreements, notes, affidavits, recordings, checks,
      emails, and correspondence, subsequent to January 1, 2007, relating to payment of
      compensation or remuneration of any kind to Marty Rathbun, between everybody else on Team Garcia. Team Garcia confirmed Marty got no compensation and they have no agreement in place to give him any. Team Scilon accepted that concession.
    Relevant snippets from Judges McCoun's ruling that address each category individually:
    • As to requests one and five, Plaintiff’s Motion is denied. [Although Team Garcia had already stipulated they would agree to No. 5 pre-hearing]
    • As for request two [footnote says judge agreed this one was overbroad]... I have reviewed the documents [in Bob Johnson's privilege log]... shared mutual interests & appears that Mr. Rinder has been retained to “bird-dog” new clients and act as a consultant, such that his communications with clients and attorneys is subject to protection as well. [So dox got sorted and cult gets to see 49 out of 300+ items on the Johnson's log].
    • As for request three [footnotes says judge agreed this one was overbroad and that that he could not find the confidentiality agreement w/ Rinder in the court record that supported cult's claim]... Plaintiffs claim the communications and other matters produced by Rinder in his consulting capacity are protected by the work product protection, if not attorney-client privilege. However, as of yet, they have failed to produce a privilege log... so Team Garcia has 14 days to produce a privilege log, in sufficient form and detail for any communications or documents supplied by Rinder in this litigation, which relate to the operations of the Church and its litigation tactics. Thereafter, the matter may be addressed on further motion, if necessary. [So there may be more Rinder dox sorting still to come].
    • As for request four... Rathbun, it is not claimed that he is anything other than a potential witness to this litigation. [So there is no privilege applied, cult wins this one] Accordingly , any outstanding subpoena directed to Mr. Rathbun appears enforceable and should be complied with... within 14 days. [With an opening left for Team Garcia to possibly shift gears and prove Marty is also a consultant and then they only have to give up a privilege dox]
    • By stipulation, request six is moot.... and denied.
    Inb4 October 3rd hearing gets delayed with a request for continuance due to M&M dox getting sorted and causing further pissing match.
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  3. Anonymous Member

    Just in case you didn't know about this:

    A concept pioneered by Aaron Swartz. If someone using RECAP (reversing PACER) has already downloaded the doc then you get access to. If not then the doc you access, if you are using RECAP, makes it available to all.

    • Like Like x 4
  4. TorontosRoot Member

    Scientology Droppings, at least they don't stink. ;)
    They lulz instead.
    • Like Like x 1
  5. The Wrong Guy Member

    Witness Lists for the Garcia Evidentiary Hearing

    While we wait for further developments in Monique Rathbun’s lawsuit in Texas, we have an update in Luis Garcia’s federal fraud lawsuit against Scientology in Tampa, Florida. On October 3, there will be an evidentiary hearing, a mini-trial to present evidence in the church’s motion to disqualify Luis and Rocio Garcia’s attorneys, Ted Babbitt and Ronald Weil. The church tried a similar strategy in Texas, and it didn’t seem to go very well. But in Tampa, the church’s case against Babbitt and Weil is based on their work with an attorney named Robert Johnson, who had previously worked for Scientology. The church is saying that’s a violation of rules, and its major piece of evidence was a declaration submitted by Brian Culkin, a former church member.

    This week, each side provided lists of witnesses they may call during the hearing, as well as lists of documents they may use as exhibits. We have both filings. And here’s the list of names that were submitted.

    Continued with open comments at
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  6. The Wrong Guy Member


    By Tony Ortega

    Tomorrow, an evidentiary hearing is scheduled to happen in the Luis and Rocio Garcia federal fraud lawsuit against the Church of Scientology, but at the last minute Scientology’s attorneys have filed a motion to compel, asking that the hearing be moved to another day because attorneys for the Garcias haven’t complied with a court order to produce evidence.

    The hearing’s purpose is to decide if Ted Babbitt and Ron Weil — the Garcias’ attorneys — acted improperly by employing another attorney, Robert Johnson, to help them recruit additional plaintiffs for the lawsuit. Johnson was once an attorney for Scientology, and the church says that’s a breach of ethics and has asked the court to disqualify Babbitt and Weil for using Johnson. After an evidentiary hearing was set in the matter, the church subpoenaed the Garcia legal team, but Babbitt objected that the subpoenas were way too broad. Magistrate Judge Thomas McCoun III agreed, in part, with Babbitt, and set limits on what the Garcia side would have to turn over. But now Scientology is saying that it still didn’t get what it was entitled to, and on the eve of the hearing, it’s complaining about it.

    We asked a member of our legal team to look over the document and interpret it for us. And that analysis is not very sanguine.

    Continued with open comments at
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  7. RightOn Member

    hey COS, you are out of steam and your bitching isn't working.
    But thank you!
    • Like Like x 2
  8. The Wrong Guy Member

    LIVE FROM TAMPA: The Garcia v. Scientology Federal Fraud Lawsuit Mini-Trial!

    By Tony Ortega

    Greetings from Tampa, Florida, where we’re on the scene for an unusual and potentially very entertaining evidentiary hearing in a fraud lawsuit that’s been derailed by accusations of unethical conduct.

    We’re anticipating that it will be a fairly grueling day for former Scientologist Brian Culkin as he’s probably going to be something of a hostile witness to both sides that want to question him today. And there’s a lot at stake — Scientology is asking the court to disqualify Ted Babbitt and Ron Weil, the attorneys for Luis and Rocio Garcia in their lawsuit that accuses the church of fraudulent behavior.

    But first, we want to warn readers that we’re up against some difficult conditions today which will definitely affect our ability to provide live coverage. According to federal court rules, we can’t bring our equipment into the courtroom, and that means we’ll be dashing across the street to type up our handwritten notes at every break. That will likely result in long periods of inactivity punctuated by rapid updates, and we know that can be frustrating. But we’ll do our best to convey what’s happening so that you get a real sense of the action.

    Continued with open comments at
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  9. RightOn Member

    Thanks Tony!
    SO looking forward to this!
    • Like Like x 2
  10. The Wrong Guy Member

    Here's the most popular comment so far to Tony's article today, written by Truthiwant:

    Seeing that today's post has to do with all the money the Garcias spent on SuperPower and the rest, I thought some of you might be interested in how a fundraising event works in Scientology.

    Sometimes the really special events are held outside of the Org in a big hotel or the like. With the one that I will describe, we were in a specially set up sports hall where Scientology had spent a lot of money with lighting and a stage. All of us were sat at tables, with maybe six to eight people at each table. There is a reason for this that I will explain later.

    These evenings always kick off with invited people talking about the fantastic wins in Scientology and sometimes a 'famous' Scientologist is invited to tell about the unbelievable new successes in the Church. That evening it was Jeff Pomerantz. The point of this part of the evening is to get everyone worked up and wooing, making you think that Scientology is so fantastic and the only thing that you should be doing in the whole world.

    At a certain point when everybody is ecstatic about the way things are going, the fundraising starts.

    At this point, one of the organizers puts up one of those paper board stands on the stage with a whole lot of white sheets of paper clipped to it. Then the celebrity, in this case Jeff Pomerantz, writes down a figure on the first sheet of paper. This is the amount that they want to raise that evening. So he writes down, I think it was 500,000 euros.

    Then just below that, he writes down another figure, 100,000 euros, and looks towards the audience and says, "Who is a big Thetan and wants to be first up on stage to make the very first donation of 100,000 euros?"

    You wouldn't believe it. That evening two whales got up and signed away 100,000 euros each! They were both from the Baggio family, a rich Italian Scientologist family.

    The donator gets up and makes his way towards the stage to great applause from all the people gathered at the event, walks on to the stage and is given a black marker pen and he signs his name just under where 100,000 euros has been written down. Then the cheering starts.

    The people who have just donated are asked to remain on stage and then the host asks again who else will come up to make a donation.

    If, after a certain amount of time nobody comes on to the stage, then the host writes another figure on the paper board stand. 50,000 euros. This carries on and the figure gets smaller . I remember that there were many people that got up when 20,000 euros was written down. Then 10,000 euros then 5,000 and finally 1,000 euros.

    Two things are happening in the meantime. The Sea Org members are all over the room and this is where the seperate tables become important. The reason for these are so that the Sea Org members can get directly behind literally everybody in the room. They hassle you at this point and stand slam bang next to you and say things like, "Go on, you can do it!"

    The second factor is that as the amount of money donated increases with more and more people going up on stage and if YOU haven't yet got up to donate, it begins to get a little bit embarrassing and you almost feel you HAVE to stand up and go on stage. Particularly at the end when the insignificant amount of 1000 euros is written down! And of course, at the same time there are the Sea Org members that are pushing you to get up. Even other people around the tables are saying to everybody else, "You can do it! You can do it!"

    There is a lot of psychology during these moments. People donate because they get that 'feel good' sense of euphoria and like being praised for getting up and going on stage so that they can have that 'everybody is clapping at me because I have donated' feeling.

    The overwhelming force to get you to donate is devastating and if you don't donate you can feel that all eyes are on you. In the mean time, the people on stage are being flattered and exalted about what a wonderful thing they have just done and how their donation is fundamental to the opening of the SuperPower building, or how they have saved mankind from the evil grips of psychiatry or whatever.

    All exits are blocked by Sea Org members during the fundraising. There is no way out!

    This goes on until they know they cannot screw any more money out of the people there and at the end, everybody is invited on to the stage, including the non-donators to sing one of those awful Scientology songs altogether (cringe).

    At this point, the fundraiser is over. The one I am describing actually made the quota needed that evening. But it is not that easy just to get out. The donators go in to a seperate room and bring out their check books to pay up and the non-donators (like me that evening) try to get out of the building. I remember being stopped by a Sea Org member and asked why I didn't donate.

    I've been to a few fundraisers in my time but this one I describe was on a level of its own. It really did shock me and I avoided fundraisers like the plague after that!
    • Like Like x 7
  11. RightOn Member

    typical church fundraising ^^^ NOT!
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  12. Anonymous Member

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  13. rickybobby Member

    Marc Headley's comment:

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  14. DeathHamster Member

    Tiny Dick: The first thing we do, let's kill remove all the lawyers.
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  15. rickybobby Member

    I think it is the only tool he has in his pseudo-lawyer toolbox. Someone told him about it once and now he wants to use it all the time.
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  16. Anonymous Member

    I love this week.
    • Like Like x 3
  17. RightOn Member

    I love this year!
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  18. Anonymous Member

    I think it's more than that. It's an intimidation tactic indicating to lawyers that if you get involved with a suit against Scientology they will go after you in addition to your clients.

    It's probably one of the reasons lawyers are reluctant to take on these cases.
    • Like Like x 1
  19. rickybobby Member

    It becomes totally ineffective if it continues to fail time after time.... especially as every motion denial on the record becomes a template for the next denial. FFS, COB needs to just give it up and find something else to spin his wheels on. He's using the same stuff he has used for years, AND IT HAS STOPPED WORKING, but he can't let it go. Yet another sign of FAIL.
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  20. anonamus Member

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  21. anonamus Member

    LOL! :D
    • Like Like x 1
  22. jensting Member

    Tony just finished describing most of this morning's comedy. No ruling yet (sorry f0r the spoiler). The good news about the Bunker is that you only need to read what Tony is posting, the comments are just fan-people going gaga.
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  23. Anonymous Member

    This one cracks me up

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  24. Anonymous Member

    Live updates are great, can't wait to get the rest tonight. Remember to F5 often so you can get them as they come in.
  25. Anonymous Member

    This will come in handy. File it away

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  26. Anonymous Member

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  27. Jeff Jacobsen Member

    The goal is to stretch out the case, wear down the judge and plaintiffs, and cause headache, derail, and expense at every turn. The goal is NEVER to go by the rules or even necessarily to win.
    • Like Like x 3
  28. Quentinanon Member

    "Never fear to hurt another in a just cause." L. Ron Hubbard
  29. TorontosRoot Member

    If they fair game the lawyers, judge and jury, oh, just watch what happens next... *grins* :evil: :eek:
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  30. RightOn Member

    what did I miss?
    Damn Scientology cases! How is anyone supposed to get any work done? :p

    oh and Happy Stat Thursday fuckers!
    • Like Like x 3
  31. anonamus Member

    "Never fear to downscale work in a just cause" should be sufficient grounds? :cool:
    And yes HAPPY STATHURSDAY to all our Clams.
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  32. Random guy Member

    This doesn't seem to go too well for the cult...
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  33. anonamus Member

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  34. Tortega just posted moar - and let slip that Ted Babbitt had given him a bijou plugette during cross of attorney Johnson, which was nice.
    • Like Like x 3
  35. Random guy Member

    The judge seems to have a very low tolerance for bollocks. I would play this very carefully if I were the cult, but somehow it seems they don't quite know how to do that.
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  36. Anonymous Member

  37. rickybobby Member

    David Miscavige isn't a very good lawyer, is he?
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  38. Random guy Member

    Oh dear, I believe the cult just had a major tactical blunder blow up in their face. Unless they get to throw Johnson, any other counsel the Garcias would hire will be subject to the same arguments for disqualification. Doesn't this open up for either a) an endless loop of counsel disqualification or b) a situation where Johnson can never be involved with a scientology case ever again? I don't think those scenarios will sit well with the judge...
    • Like Like x 2
  39. Anonymous Member

    But the Judge is also saying he can't bar Johnson from consulting. He can only remove attorneys of record.
  40. Anonymous Member

    Babbitt said as much in his closing argument.

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