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Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

Discussion in 'Leaks & Legal' started by firebug, Oct 26, 2009.

  1. exOT8Michael Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    I love that gif

    I love the verdict even more. Frank Rosenberg was responsible for ruining my life in France by Fair Game.
    Karma is now paying him back.
    Vive La France !!!
  2. getbeckyout Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    BBC UK

    Scientologists convicted of fraud

    Scientology's Celebrity Centre in Paris was fined in the ruling
    A French court has convicted the Church of Scientology of fraud, but stopped short of banning the group from operating in France.

    Two branches of the group's operations and several of its leaders in France have been fined.

    The case came after complaints from two women, one of whom said she was manipulated into paying more than 20,000 euros (£18,100) in the 1990s.

    A Scientology spokesman told the BBC the verdict was "all bark and no bite".

    France regards Scientology as a sect, not a religion.

    Prosecutors had asked for the group's French operations to be dissolved and more heavily fined, but a legal loophole prevented any ban.

    Instead, a Paris judge ordered the Church's Celebrity Centre and a bookshop to pay a 600,000-euro fine.

    Alain Rosenberg, the group's head in France, was handed a two-year suspended jail sentence and fined 30,000 euros.

    Three other leading members of the group were also fined.

    Ban 'still possible'

    Unlike the US, France has always refused to recognise Scientology as a religion, arguing that it is a purely commercial operation designed to make as much money as it can at the expense of often vulnerable victims, the BBC's Emma Jane Kirby reports from Paris.


    Religious freedom is in danger in this country

    Eric Roux
    French Celebrity Centre spokesman
    Over the past 10 years, France has taken several individual members of the group to court on charges of fraud and misleading publicity, but this is the first time the organisation itself has been charged, she says.

    Tommy Davis, spokesman for the Church of Scientology International, told BBC News that the court had acted "in total violation of the European Convention on Human Rights and French constitutional guarantees on freedom".

    The case "fell flat on its face", he said.

    "The fines will get thrown out on appeal. We've had similar cases before and in other countries. If it has to go to the court of human rights we're confident we will win there."

    Speaking by phone from the US, he said it was a "political gesture" against the organisation, but "Scientology will continue to grow in France".

    The Church of Scientology was founded in 1954 by the late science fiction writer L Ron Hubbard, and includes Hollywood stars such as John Travolta and Tom Cruise.

    Manipulation claims

    In the case leading up to Tuesday's ruling, a woman said she was sold expensive life-improvement courses, vitamins and other products after taking a personality test.

    A second woman alleges she was fired by her Scientologist boss after refusing to undergo testing and sign up to courses.

    The organisation denied that any mental manipulation took place.

    The court was unable to impose a ban because of a legal amendment that was passed just before the trial began, preventing the banning of an organisation convicted of fraud.

    However, that amendment has now been changed.

    "It is very regrettable that the law quietly changed before the trial," Georges Fenech, the head of the Inter-ministerial Unit to Monitor and Fight Cults, told French TV.

    "The system has now been put in place by parliament and it is certain that in the future, if new offences are committed, a ban could eventually be pronounced," he said.

    A lawyer defending Scientology's operations in France said there would be an appeal.

    Eric Roux, a spokesman for the Celebrity Centre, urged France to recognise Scientology's "legality".

    "Religious freedom is in danger in this country," he said.
  3. Anonymous Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    no one cares.
  4. Kha Khan Member

    Slashdot: French Branch of Scientology Is Convicted of Fraud


    Slashdot: Your Rights Online: French Branch of Scientology Is Convicted of Fraud


    Anons and other critics may wish to comment on the Slashdot article.
  5. Herro Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    I told you fuckers the state was going to pwn scientology in France. Don't ever doubt me again my children.
  6. Anonymous Member

  7. Herro Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Ha, I called it fuckers. Told you France would likely smack them down. Don't ever doubt me my children. This is great news. I love seeing arrogant people getting their comeuppance.


    It just wouldn't be a WWP thread without moonbat fail. The response of the Church to the verdict is a more recent development in the story. CNN always changes headlines to reflect recent events in developing stories. Now run along and continue to tinfoil your walls. Don't forget to put soft rubber around all the sharp things in your house while you're at it. We wouldn't want you hurting yourself.


    You left out dog poisoning.
  8. Vir Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    So can we get good information on exactly why the cult wasn't banned? I see a lot of the media is running with the "technicality" explanation, but sources closer to the original seem to say that it was because Scientology would just operate illegally anyway.

    .
  9. Anonymous Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    As part of the penalties, the church was ordered to publish the results of the verdict in several national and international magazines to warn people, the judge said, about what Scientology offers and what was discovered at trial.


    I love this ^^

    The fines weren't big enough and the jail terms weren't long enough but it's still win.

    Looking forward to seeing what this inspires on banners at the next protests outside the Orgs.
  10. Skeptic1337 Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Noice.
  11. Antagone Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    Graeme Wilson on BBC4 news at the moment claiming it's a witch hunt, inquisition etc. Also saying the Church is ran as a non-profit organisation all over the world.

    Shame I'm not taping this since the interviewer has just said the CoS is perceived as being a bit 'wacky' and a 'cult'. Wilson's response is to plug the CoS website.
  12. Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    herd.jpg
  13. basil Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    If it's not "run for profit" ... then why are all the courses so expensive? Where does the money go?
  14. Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Am I right in thinking these fines won't be paid until they go through the appeals process?
  15. Rhamni Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Somebody should answer this.

    Edit: More specifically, somebody should say to what degree they have to insert disclaimers from now on. Are we talking one little square on the website, or tobacco style "Joining Scientology may serioulsy harm you and those financially dependant on you?" warnings on the stress test coupons?
  16. Anonymous Member

  17. JMac85 Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    "This video is not available in your country due to copyright restrictions."

    D'oh!
  18. Herro Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Hey, someone's got to pay for DM's hookers and blow. That man is a motherfuckin P I M P
  19. Anonymous Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    Works from France.
  20. Antagone Member

    Re: French Convictions: Media Deluge

    Yeah, we raged a bit watching it as well but it was clear the woman interviewing didn't think much of the Cult, even though she obviously doesn't know as much about it as us Anons do.

    Wilson waffled on about how all the money is ploughed back into doing good works such as combating the problem of children taking drugs. Too bad he didn't add that meant not taking prescribed drugs as well.
  21. Anonymous Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Scilons convicted of fraud would make a nice troll sign.
  22. Anonymous Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Yes it will.
  23. AnonymeFR Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Did someone called the Herald Tribune, Time Magazine + ??? ( there were a third I believe) in order to know if/when this publication will occur ?

    BTW What about the appeal ? I don't know if such publication can be printed before or only after the appeal....
  24. OHSHI Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgbQ3cS3r-s"]YouTube - Scientology Convicted of Organized Fraud in France - CNN Report[/ame]
  25. Anonymous Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Scientology convicted of
    organized fraud
  26. Anonymous Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Birmingham (UK) area journalist and talkSPORT radio show host Adrian Goldberg, posting on his website The Stirrer:

  27. Anonymous Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Couldn't find anything on the site, but I just heard a decent blurb on the CBC evening news about it.

    Started with "a major victory for critics of scientology today in France'
  28. Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in


    In 1978, L. Ron Hubbard was convicted of fraudulant claims in France also, so comitting fraud is long held tradition in the blessed "Church" of Scientology.

    When LRH returns from his "research" in outer space he can serve the 4 year prison term he was sentenced to.

    DM has proudly carried the long tradition of fraud forward as the "ecclesiastial leader" of Scientology and if he needs a place to stay, there's an empty cell in France not being used at the moment.

    Here's the latest video of David Miscavige's French Foreign Legion, Sea-Org. Division, Commander Biff Hubbard in full Sea-Org regalia nervously pacing outside the courtroom:

  29. Anonymous Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    I think that cell is already occupied by Bubba La Prison Rapiste.
  30. XenuPhobic Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    It would be great if someone with TV recording capabilities compiled all of the various reports on TV. Would love to watch them and bask in the glow of win. :)
  31. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Tin foil? Where? I was just observing the basis for this:
    And NO prison time for anybody. I'm kind of annoyed by that.

    However, after digesting the rest of the thread and thinking more about it all, I guess I was too glum over the disappointing bits. On the whole, obviously, it's a huge downstat for the cult in France and the "PR flap" is global and lulzy. So, a tasty win, despite a few gristly chunks to spit out.

    Oh please, yes... that would repair the deficiencies very nicely.

    One more time won't hurt. This photo is truly EPIC win. ahaha

    DO WANT. Ling a ling ling!

    (no)
    I don't think American law works that way either though. Appealing a verdict isn't a new trial, it's a continuation of the same trial, isn't it?

    So the only way they can avoid getting v& and b& is by squirrelling the tech? Niiiice. Maybe this is pure win after all, just partly in slow motion.

    I thought of something else about this: the court ultimately didn't want to use the ban option, which means that the whole flapdoodle about that law getting changed was not relevant to the outcome of the case, but was footbullety for the cult, at least in terms of PR. If they called in any favors to get it done, they wasted them, earning nothing of value and instead incurring disfavor among the people and legislators of (at least) France. FAIL.
  32. moarxenu Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    ^^THIS^^

    An important dimension of these cases is that Scientology is not doing anything different in Paris that it is doing in London, Washington DC, Sydney, and everywhere else.

    Standard tech is standard and micro-managed by David Miscavige the world over. That is his job as COB of the RTC.
  33. moarxenu Member

  34. Olrik Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Very lulzy.
  35. anon555 Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    heard this story mentioned on the morning radio show, i dont thnk there's a media outlet not covering it.

    while I'd love to see the COS banned in France, IMO a fraud conviction without a ban is a hundred times better, because there's no whining about religious persecution, no american politicians running around and sending worthless letters about how religions shouldn't be banned etc...just cold, hard, unambiguous fraud.
  36. Olrik Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Sentence is really really smart. Just heard Roger Gonnet on radio. Very happy he is.
  37. basil Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    I didn't see anything on the "Amateur Gardener Magazine" website.

    Yet.
  38. Anonynamefag Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    tincat2.jpg
  39. Anonymous Member

    Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    Most likely the latter, at least once cooler heads prevailed. Other countries like Germany and Belgium ultimately came around to the same sort of reasoning.

    Banning the cult all together from operating in France would be just about as productive as banning Herro from WWP. In the long run, it's better that they be given time to fail and fade away by their own actions.
  40. Re: Verdict: GUILTY! French trial verdicts are in

    WIN! Nice blow to the Scientology control issues without turning them into martyrs.




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