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YouTube Hacked 7/4/10

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Anonymous, Jul 4, 2010.

  1. Anonymous Member

    Re: YouTube Hacked 7/4/10

    Nice snip and paste. First, you got the number of the Federalist wrong, it was 10, one of the most famous of them.

    Except the context shows he was referring to a "pure democracy."

    There would be no need for the modifier "pure" if a republic were not some form of democracy. Madison's point is that democracy has numerous failings and is absolutely unworkable in a pure form. Attempts at it in any sizable society will inevitably fail.

    The framers did not use their words carelessly, and if the word is there, it is for a reason, and intended to have a meaning.

    Admittedly, there are other places in the Federalist (such as #14) where Madison is not explicit about this distinction, but he was clearly aware that there are different kinds of democracy.

    Madison would certainly be aware of this, as would all the Framers, through his study of Blackstone, who uses the terms "republic" and "democracy" interchangeably.

    Blackstone lists three forms of government: a democracy, an aristocracy, and a monarchy. Then, he goes on to use the word "republic" as if it is interchangeable with "democracy." Additionally, he refers to "popular assemblies," which at the time would have meant legislative bodies elected directly by the people, that is, a representative democracy.

    Finally, to finish all this off in one post so I won't have to go into it anymore, the second most cited thinker by the Founders was Montesquieu, whose notion of separation of powers guaranteed the longevity of the Union, which is now the longest continuously existing constitutional republics on Earth. Since the first most cited thinker by the Founders was St. Paul from the Bible, Montesquieu is certainly the top thinker on issues of republicanism. Montesquieu, as well, made it quite clear that a republic was a form of democracy.

    Montesquieu, throughout, uses the words "republic" and "democracy" interchangeably.

    I suppose I should rephrase my original statement, though. That there were attributes a republic has which not all democracies have was certainly well known. However, the concept that a democracy can't be a republic or that a republic can't be a democracy remains utter nonsense.

    That there are Republicans who deny that the United States is a democracy, and Democrats who deny that the United States is a republic, seems to me to stem simply from a dislike of the name of the other party, which prompts them to try to change the definition of the words they want to devalue. It's intellectually dishonest, but worse, it's extremely silly.

    [/threadjack]
  2. Anonymous Member

    Re: YouTube Hacked 7/4/10

    Independence Day Mayhem: YouTube and iTunes Hacked

    In one article we are a "brief fad" and in another an "ongoing protest"....c est la vie.

    Mostly this thing is just funny as hell to me (the YT Hack, Send Beiber to Best Korea, etc.). The first story I posted today is fucking lulzy; read it for sure. The whole thing interests me for the lulz, the Anon/Chanology confusion, and in the larger sociological/political implications.

    And incidentally, I have not been involved in the Bieber raid or the YT attack, but I'm sure there are some among us who participated. Ok. I did vote to send Bieber to North Korea.

    And the Jonas Brothers to Somalia.

    And Miley Cyrus to Antarctica.

    The biggest revelation for me at least, as it relates to all this recent news, is that Chanology is the only real, self-sustaining splinter cell to come out of any Anonymous raid or invasion. I suppose I already knew that, but it had not occurred to me in this context previously.

    Even though most channers hate us know and view us as the retarded brother they're embarrassed to have, they'll bask in our sweet success once we finish the cult, declare it "EPIC WIN" and say they were with us all along.

    That's fair enough.

    We are the proof of concept test case for this type of internet activism with several battles won already; our validation in this regard (although by no means personally or within our own group dynamic) comes with our final victory or a blow so damaging the cult cannot recover.

    When that finally occurs, we'll have a long line of people claiming credit, involvement and support.

    Sorry for all that. To be honest, I'm high and rambling a bit.

    ALSO, will you faggots take your 'democracy' v. 'republic' off-topic bullshit someplace else.
  3. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: YouTube Hacked 7/4/10

    I'll echo all of that, except that I stand by my statement (citing Orwell) that sloppy language results in sloppy thinking and that this is one example of such. While the writers you cite may have understood the distinctions we're discussing, people today mostly don't, and that's my butthurt here.

    However, it isn't relevant to Chanology, so:

    /threadjack
  4. AMoniker Member

    Re: YouTube Hacked 7/4/10

    Haha. They're afraid to google 4chan. Scrubs.

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